Thank you so much for joining me. It’s great to have you here. It’s taken me a long time to write the intro for this particular episode. I would start, then stop, then start again. I had to really think deeply about how to formulate my words. This episode today is an interview, with a very brave young woman. Who is speaking out for the first time ever, about what she experienced for a period of roughly six years. The effects of which tore her family apart, and the ripples are still being felt in their lives currently. It’s in parts –  to me, very sad. And it’s taken my guest a lot to get to the space she has gotten to in her life today. So many times during the course of our conversation I wished that I could reach through my zoom room, where I do my interviews and give her a hug. It was actually quite a hard interview for me to do, because, I have a family member who is currently dealing with a similar situation.

Only in her case, I cannot remove the entity that’s attached to her. An entity who is influencing her addiction, because, she does not want to let him go. I sadly watch on the sidelines, as her family is being decimated, and innocent young lives are being destroyed because of it. She tries very hard to get clean, I have lost count of the number of times she has detoxed and then has just gone right back to where she left off. All because of the influence of a very human spirit who latched onto her when she was a very young mum. Who has steadily influenced her behaviour, and has eroded her self-confidence and ability to recognise when she is being influenced by him. And yes, she is very aware of his presence, he doesn’t bother to hide himself any more. Why should he? He has no need to any more.

However, this is my guest’s story. A story of drugs, abuse and of low level entities that influence many who are addicted – whether that is to drugs, be they recreational or prescription, or as in my family member’s case to alcohol. Or, to gambling, to sex – whatever type their addiction takes. So having said all of that – are you still willing to walk with me into this part of the shadowlands, and see what awaits us there? Then let’s begin.

The Entity

Before I introduce my guest I want to talk for just a minute or two about spirit attachment and influence. I won’t go into to too much detail as I have an episode coming up about spirit possession and walk-ins, and what the difference is.

Actually spirit attachment is not as common as people think it is from all the TV shows and movies made showing such events. Being influenced, by lower level spirit however is. So perhaps first I should specify what spirit attachment is, because, there may be some listening who have never even heard of that.

So an attachment can be called a number of things. Such as an attachment, a spiritual attack, spirit possession, or energy possession – although the term possession generally isn’t used because most associate that with religions and the term demonic with it’s religious connotations. The attachments can be in varying degrees, from merely influencing, to full on controlling the person’s actions.  These are always done without the person’s consent.

The most common type of attachments are earthbound spirits, those who for one reason or another – generally because they had an addiction that lead to their death, don’t want to move on. They are still craving their addiction that they had in life. Then we have inter-dimensional energies who have never had a body or lived life in this dimension. They can be very dark, negative and extremely nasty.

What are signs and Symptoms of an attachment?

A spirit attachment can start to show that it’s in a person’s life, with a large number of symptoms. Most really subtle at first, then after a while, any pretence at subtleness disappears. As I mentioned previously the spirit or entity does not seek permission of the person it is attaching to. It simply forces its way into the person’s energy or auric field. This generally happens when the person is at a very low energy point in their lives, or whilst they are particularly weak or vulnerable. Or, unconscious from drug or alcohol abuse, or under the influence of such, or from deliberately opening themselves to attachment via some other methods which are beyond the scope of this episode.

Once the spirit or energy gains entry, to your energy, it will leave a hole or a tear on your aura – the energy that surrounds every living person. Once that happens, then it is possible for other attachments to join or sort of piggy back on the original attachment.

Here are some possible signs of spirit attachment or influence. However; never ever, ever, assume that these are because of spiritual attachments – always, always, always, get checked by a health professional before looking towards the spiritual causes. Because, there can be a number of physiological or psychological reasons for some of these symptoms. So check out the mundane to begin with. Once that’s ruled out, then and only then should you can look at spiritual causes. So some of the signs of possible attachments are:

• Abrupt and sudden, unexplained changes in the behaviour of the person being influenced. Changes like increased anger as with my guest’s father. Depression, or wanting to hurt others. And, or continual thoughts of murder or suicide.
• Sudden cravings for alcohol, cigarettes, recreational and illicit drugs, sex– especially if the person doesn’t normally use them, or is quite modest in their sexual appetites.
• Hearing voices, when the person never has before
• Fears, or phobias never experienced before.
• Serious illness of unknown cause, or unexplained health/physical problems
• Memory and concentration problems
• Severe personality disorders
• Migraine headaches, when never experienced before
• Panic or anxiety attacks

These are some of the symptoms you can get with attachments. And make no mistake about it. These are parasites that need to be removed from that person’s energy field. They are a huge threat to a person’s, physical and mental well being. Although, as I have mentioned in the Ouija board episode last season, if a person really wants that entity or spirit there, like with my relative,  then nothing I or anyone else can do, will remove it.

Mostly the spirit attachments simply want to get their preferred fix, via their host body. However, in the case of the inter-dimensional energies, that have never had a body – they simply want to cause, havoc and as much pain as they can. They feed off of it. Yes, both of these can be removed, if the person wants them gone, genuinely wants them gone from their lives. They can be removed and the hole in the person’s auric field healed so no other can find entry. So with this back ground on attachments I would like to now introduce my guest Michelle.

Michelle grew up in Colorado, USA. She came from a small family, just herself, her brother and her Mum and Dad. She has completed a four year Arts degree, majoring in Videography, with a minor in American Sign language. She’s currently busy organising her upcoming wedding in October, and her story begins when she started College. So I would like introduce my guest Michelle.

Michelle

Marianne: Thank you very much for agreeing to talk to us today Michelle. I’m sure that my listeners – There maybe some in the same situation that you were and that your story might help.

Michelle: Yes. I hope that my story can help some people and I hope that those people don’t feel like they’re alone. Because, I felt very alone in my situation and it was it was really hard to go through my situation alone, with them. Yeah. So my name is Michelle and my story starts probably when I entered into college. I think, when I started college.

Right.  Oh college, so by college you’re talking –  we would call that university here in New Zealand.

Yes. You would call that university.

Right gotcha

Yeah. I went to a community college. So I still call that college but I did end up going to university later. Which was a four year. So very proud of that.

What did you study as a matter of interest?

I studied videography and how we communicate through film with a minor in American Sign Language.

Oh wow. That’s awesome! And it’s so creative.

Yes! I’m a very creative person. And you…. You; kind of find that through a lot of the things that I’ve, I’ve done is the way that I coped with the situation it was through art and creativity. And that’s kind of how I dealt with the situation. And it was really hard sometimes. But Art got me through it.

Right. Right. I totally get that. That’s your grounding and your healing.

Yes, it very much was. That was how I got through almost everything. OK. So yes when I was in when I was starting college my, my parents –  I was living with my parents and my brother. And it was just the four of us and the dog. The two dogs that we had. And of course I had pet rats and the pet rats will come in later. I love rats. Just I know that they’re not very popular especially in New York and what not, but they were wonderful creatures and looking at it now they taught me a lot about life

It’s just like their tails get me. I don’t mind their bodies, but their tails give me the creeps.

Oh wasn’t their tails got me at the first. It was their back feet, disgusting! Their back feet were gross but it took me a bit, but it was so nice to have somebody to kind of come home to during this situation but I’m getting ahead of myself.  So during that time it was all of all of us together and my aunt had called my mom one day and said that her daughter was having some problems. And we didn’t really know the extent of the problem. We just knew that she was kind of addicted to heroin.

We didn’t know how bad it was, until she got to live with us.  And I begged and I had pleaded with my parents as a please don’t let her live with us. I told them anything.  I said you won’t love me any more please don’t let her live with us. Please, please, please! I just had this gut feeling right that something bad was going to happen. I didn’t know what it was. I just had this feeling and I begged and I pleaded and I said please, please, please. And of course I was stuck at that time you know? I was going to college.

And I was like doing classes all the time, and I was you know I was not doing too well in my classes at that time. And I was kind of in the party phase a little bit. And you know, there is  – yeah there was a lot that was going on during that time. But I had begged and pleaded and asked them not to let her stay with us and they turned me down every time eventually she did stay with us and she stayed with us for about six months.

And during that time things changed. The dynamics of the family did change. There was more arguments. There was more fighting. And before this –  I mean the family there were arguments but it wasn’t this bad. You know? At times my dad…. He just –  you know –  it was almost like he would go around to pick fights with people purposefully and that was not a thing that would happen before.  And it was really upsetting and depressing going through the situation with my dad. And my mom was just depressed all the time.

And it got to the point where my cousin was doing heroin inside the house. And yeah, she was smoking weed.  She was doing heroin. I don’t know how you do heroin. I don’t know if it was like injecting heroin or something. I think she was smoking it I found a foils with heroin in it. And we did not know at the time but when she came to stay with us, she was actually wanted in another state. And it was it was very it was really serious and it got to the point where we couldn’t take it any more.

Sorry to interrupt Michelle. So before your cousin came to live with you your mother didn’t have depression?

No. We were just a normal family my parents we would we’d go out we would hang out at stores and stuff like that. And, you know, things seemed to be okay. You know I don’t know if maybe my cousin coming maybe influenced the depression or maybe magnified it and what not right. But, the situation just kind of got worse when she stayed with us. I think the dynamics of the family really did shift around quite a bit and around the end of the six months that she was with us, there was a huge fight between Mom, Dad, and my cousin and they were saying you need to leave.

You need to get out. We don’t allow this in the house because I had showed them the heroin that she was using right. And I said this is not OK. This was one of the rules you laid down. And, this is not an OK thing for you to have done. And I showed them this, and they said that she needed to leave. And my cousin knew I had showed them because how else with her would they have found else?

And, we had a house at the time and I haven’t told anybody this really, because, nobody had really believed me much.  And, at the time like I said I was I was Christian and I was not a Wiccan. And I looked down the stairs because you could see down the stairs from the banister. So there was a railing and you could see down the stairs. And my cousin looked at me and I swear her eyes turned glossy black, and for a second she had horns.

Like it was a split second. It was almost like you imagined it.  But, I swear it was real right. It was so real! And, she looked at me gave me this horrible, nasty, snarling look and I felt like she was going to hurt me! I just felt awful dread and like –  I felt like I was in danger.  Like even talking about it right now, I’m getting goose bumps. It was –  it was intense. And, I was so scared to go to sleep that night, because, I felt like she was gonna hurt me. So I ended up sleeping in my parent’s room. At eighteen – nineteen years old I’m sleeping in my parent’s room because that’s how terrifying it was.

It must have been really scary for you to do that.

Yeah it was! It was really really. So the next day she was on the bus to go back to Nevada. So, I was in Colorado and she’s going to Nevada, which was back where she came. And, after that everything in the house had changed.  And two weeks went by. One of my rats died and I don’t know how she died. I’d take very good care of my rodents. I loved them dearly and I had two of them. So, for that one to die it was just very strange.

My mom got into a car accident a week later and this car accident changed her life and has changed her life completely, and it still affects her to this day. And it’s been about 10 years since this whole situation happened with my cousin staying. So this car accident had been horrendous. She had something called a TBI afterwards, which is a traumatic brain injury. And she actually started taking pills after that opioids which is heroin. And my dad not only would pick fights purposefully, but started getting physical with my brother.

And, he was never like that before your cousin left – before your cousin arrived?

No. Never like that. I know my cousin was there, she would purposely try to start things too. She would sit there and try to you know start some things, and I know that when she was there –  things would move around the house.  And it wasn’t just when she was there. She would be at her meetings and whatnot. I would set something down and I would go, oh my gosh where did my keys go? Where did my homework go? Where did my book go? And it would just be moving around the house.

So…. So what you’re saying is that while she lived with you, you started having paranormal events happening in your home that didn’t happen prior to her arriving?

Correct. Yeah right. But it was so minimal that it was so minimal that it was almost like, oh well, I must have misplaced it.  I must have put it over here. Oh, I must have not been thinking.  I must be taking too many classes.  I must have done too much today and just not have thought you know?  So it wasn’t it wasn’t a lot of paranormal activity, but, looking back at it I’m like oh….  That was, I think what started it. Because of the situation with the black eyes and the horns and just what I had seen and felt that night. I’m like, something was messing with us.

Right. Absolutely. Did you…. When…. As she left, did your parents feel anything? Did your Mum or Dad say anything?

So they were true Christians. They were not going to talk about anything like that. And, even to this day they still will not talk about anything like that. I try to talk with them about these things. But they didn’t talk about it. And, it got to –  the paranormal activity kind of stopped a little bit after she left. And I didn’t, we didn’t know this, but, during this time that my cousin was there my brother was talking with a girl who lived in California and we had planned a family vacation. To go to California.

And so my brother kind of ran away during this big family vacation and he went to go live with this girl for about a week or so. And he ended up bringing this girl back to Colorado. And, she practiced witchcraft which I don’t want to say anything negative about. But, she did practice the darker side of things and she did tell us that.  She was Hispanic and she had a grandmother who practiced and they used like baby bones. Yes.  They used baby bones and they use blood magic.  And they use like those kinds of like darker things.

And one of the things she brought with her was a Ouija board. And she pressured me and my brother to play the Ouija board. And for days and weeks I’d be like no, no, I don’t want to play the Ouija board. And then eventually I was like fine I will play the Ouija board, cause like half of me was really curious.  And half of me was kind of like oh you know I don’t want to play with that Ouija board. Because, you know, it went against my belief systems and I’ve, I’ve read a lot of stories that it doesn’t end well. It didn’t end well for us either.

And this, and this is in your family home? And your parents knew? They obviously they didn’t know?

No.  My mom would work a lot and my dad would work a lot. So he would work nights and my mom would work during the day. So they were gone, almost constantly. So during the day Dad would sleep and mom –  or dad would work nights. And when mom was working, then she’d sleep and stuff like that. So they were almost –  you know we call them –  we call ourselves latchkey children here. Or latchkey kids, because, you know, we didn’t really have our parents around a lot.

Oh that’s awful.

Yeah it has its moments where it’s pretty bad. And I think the situation was pretty bad having to deal with this spiritual relief and not being prepared for it. And what had happened. So we played with the Ouija board. We didn’t get much activity but we did ask some questions you should never ask the Ouija board. Like when you’re gonna die. And you know things like that you should not ask.

And we did get some answers but we think what ever was giving us answers was messing with us and pretending to be my grandmother, who had passed away. ‘Cause, we were trying to connect with her and it was just a bad situation. I should also mention that my brother had also got her pregnant and so they had also lost a baby. And they were and they were trying to contact the baby to see what its name would have been, or what it wanted to be named and things like that. And so they were dealing with loss and grief. And so, when you’re dealing with those kinds of things and especially my brother took it really, really, really bad. It was it was extremely bad.

And, I should probably mention after my cousin left my brother became extremely suicidal. We were up with him. For days to make sure he wouldn’t hurt himself. And like we had to hide the knives. We had to hide the guns. We had to hide every single –  because he was going to kill himself, and he told us multiple times.  And, like that was an entire situation. I think with everything that was just going on I didn’t- you know, when you’re in that situation you don’t realize what’s happening.

No. Of course.

You know it’s fight or flight, fight or flight, fight or flight. And, with everything just coming at you, coming at you, coming at you, you know.  It’s just one thing after another and you’re like, Oh, my God look at all these things that I’ve built up.

Yeah. Just another thing to deal with and your brother was not like that?  Didn’t suffer from depression prior to your cousin coming and living with you?

He actually had an entire personality change and if you were to see pictures of him before, to pictures of him afterwards –  and I showed my fiancé, and he said “That’s not your brother. That’s not, that’s not him.”

He –  He stopped eating. He had a…. It was horrible for my brother.  My brother probably had it the worst and my brother, I think, is the most traumatic one for me to deal with as well.  Because, he –  you know I sat there with him and I was like you’re going to be OK. It’s gonna be OK and we’re gonna sit through this together.  And you know what?  If you need anything, you’re going to tell me and we’re going to talk about it. But he just felt like there was no way out. And this was before he lost the baby.

Wow, your poor brother. Hmm.  So it sounds to me like if there was quite oppressive energy brought in, by your cousin, into your home. That obviously stayed there and have influenced happenings in the home. Right.  And so then, you did this Ouija board and I suspect hearing what you see that you more did it because you wanted to support your brother and his grief?  The curiosity about how it works? Would that be fair to say?

Yeah there was some curiosity. I mean I did ask why, to see if grandma was there and I wanted to know like a couple of things. But. You know they would bring up oh when are we going to die? and stuff. And I was like k, we need to not ask those things. Because, I knew like you don’t ask those kinds of things, when you play with the Ouija board. And it was really, it was really eye opening afterwards.

I mean, it wasn’t even –  it was probably two day’s later stuff started ramping up. And that’s when the paranormal activity started really, really getting out of hand. So me and my brother’s girlfriend who is living with us we would get into fights constantly because she said oh you move my makeup or you move this case you move this. And I’d say Hey you took this thing. You moved this thing over.  And you know, later I realize that, you know, she –  she wasn’t moving things around. 

And it was one day and I remember this very vividly.  One day when I was at home and I was getting into a situation at work, where there was some legal stuff going on with me at work. I mean nothing ever came out of it but. There was, you know, legal stuff that was happening at work.  And people were accusing me of stuff that I didn’t do.  And I was at home it was New Year’s Eve.  Everyone was out of the house and I heard footsteps upstairs! And I was like, no one’s home? How can – I don’t understand how can this be happening? You know I was so confused.

There was footsteps and then, like the lights would flicker. Sometimes the lights wouldn’t even turn on. And then I’d say Mom Dad you know you need to change the light bulb. And then the lights would turn on and I’d be like am I going crazy? You know? And there was one night when his girlfriend was asleep and I was asleep or we were trying to sleep. And we eventually had gotten to sleep.  And that night I felt like something was watching me. I just felt this presence in the room.  But, it wasn’t like –  it was like it was all around me. Like there was no way to escape it. And when I fell asleep that night it was this dark entity that was looming over the bed.  Like at the foot of the bed, just looming. Just watching you. And it was kind of watching you with a feeling of like; you’re gonna sleep when I tell you to.  Or, you’re gonna do what I want.

It’s kind of like one of those feelings? It’s very strange. It’s very hard to explain. And so I got up in the morning I’m like mom you know like, I had a really strange dream. It’s this really really weird dream. And, I told her about it. And then my boyfriends, or my brother’s sister, my brother’s girlfriend –  sorry my brother’s girlfriend, got up and explained her dream to my brother.

And my brother and my mom were talking about these dreams, like later in the day. And I was at work and his girlfriend was, you know, doing whatever around the house.  And she was trying to find a job and what not. And I came home that night my mom’s like you two had the same dream that night. Like, did you realize that you both had the same dream? Did you talk to her? Did you guys plan this? No. We didn’t. We didn’t plan it so it was just very strange.

Eventually one thing led to another and his girlfriend did have to leave. And I don’t think that the activity had ever really calmed down. But, I do think that we just kind of ignored it. Because of everything that was going on. It was more affecting people’s personalities and how they were. My brother ended up trying mushrooms, LSD, cocaine, for a little while. It, it was a lot.

So do you feel that whatever this entity was, that was in your home. That was influencing your emotions, also influenced your brother into this path? Thing is, it seems to be, seems to me –  seems to me, that he was the target in all of this.  Or the most vulnerable person.

I do. I do think that he was the most vulnerable person, because, he was the youngest. And because, he was going through critical stages in life. And I do also think that my dad saying and like picking fights with people and like…. You can only take that for so long, you know?  Somebody just picking at you and picking at you and picking at you. It’s a lot like the Chinese water torture, you know, a couple of drops on your forehand probably wouldn’t hurt. But, after a few hours or days of that, you’d probably want out.

Yes. Absolutely. Yes.

And so that’s kind of what I think happened with my brother is he just he needed out and he wanted out. And I think that path was kind of –  he was forced into that path. So…

And it feels to me that whatever entity was attached to your cousin was influencing her drug use as well. And, that’s the feeling I get about it anyway.

Yeah. I think that this entity grew stronger every time that she would use her drugs that I know that when she would use at least with marijuana which you know is marijuana. Think what you want about it. Yeah. But she would always offer it to somebody say hey you should try it with me you should try it with me you should try it with me.

And I think that there’s some part of that. And yes I think that’s a drug thing. But I think that there’s some part of that where the entity is like I want to grow stronger get people in your ring. Get a hold of them. And I think my brother was just kind of the next victim because there were some instances where I had caught him, selling drugs at school as well. Like he had gotten involved with a drug ring at some point.

And I told him, I said you know you need to sort this you’re not going down a good path. And you know, I don’t think it affected me quite as much because my whole thought process during this was go upstairs, stay invisible. And I would get the pets whenever Dad and my brother would go at it. I’d get the pets.

And I would say you’re coming in the room here. I don’t care if you can understand what I’m saying. You’re coming in the room with me and we’re hanging out. And I would watch my TV and I would do what I needed to do, to go to sleep and take care of the animals, and just whatever…

To escape the situation. Yeah right. I understand that, because, your room was your safe haven? So obviously this whole…. Oh I’m sorry. Did you? Did you find that overall, with every family member, did you find that their behavior in the home, was different than their behavior out of the home? Like for yourself, for example, did you feel like clear – more clear- headed out of the home than in the home? Like did you feel the difference in your behaviour or the way you felt generally?

Yes. Yes. Not just with me but with family members as well. So we had vacations after this would happen. And my dad and my mom were almost normal. It was like we were a family again! You know we were out of the house, but, then we have to go back. And I actually had friends that would come over, because, you know I was in university. I was in college and stuff.  And they would come over and they would say you know what’s going on with your house.

I say what do you mean? And they say you can you can cut the tension in that house with a knife.  You can feel some sort of energy in that house with a knife.  You can you can walk in there and it feels like you can’t breathe. Personally, I don’t know how the hell that household –  because it feels just so dark in there.  Especially when you go into my parent’s room.  My parent’s room is the worst because that’s where they fought the most. And so that’s kind of where the epicenter point is of the arguments.  And I think there’s a lot of …. I think there might be an open door there, because, we also didn’t we didn’t say goodbye with the Ouija board.  Which is a big thing.  You have to say goodbye. You have to close it out properly. And I think that let a lot of negative energies out in there. And it was very negative.

And I can tell you when I moved out –  so I ended up moving out in 2016.  And my grades went up. I was chosen for a scholarship, from my college. Yeah I actually had a 4.0 GPA at one point.

Is that?

Like, I was super proud of myself!

It’s obviously a good grade I don’t understand the American grading system, but….

Yeah. It’s a grade point average so they take an average of your grades. And so it’s, it’s, it’s really, really good.  And it’s like a really positive thing. And when I graduated I had all these medals and awards and they chose me to go up to the only deaf school in the world! And actually film a documentary up there and that’s when I moved out.  And my fiancée was like, “Holy crap you can do so much stuff when you are out of such bad situations.” You know it’s amazing how much people can thrive when they’re not in such

Oppressive?

hell in their mind.  

Right, right. And of course, it was an oppressive situation and whatever was in your home was deliberately creating that environment. Because, it fed off those fear energies, those negative energies.

Yeah. And I think it’s interesting how my parents ended up leaving the house too because they were going to stay in that house. And two thousand nineteen –  actually was last year.  My dad was taken by the police here, because, he was showing some disturbing signs. He…. I’ll give you the short version because it’s quite long, but the radio had given him an address.  And this is what he’s telling us. But, the radio in his car had given him an address and this address was supposedly an address to a family. And, the man was cheating on his family with my mom. And my dad was going to go over there and kill them! The entire family. And so we called the police and they took my dad and they took him for about eight days.

And they diagnosed him with schizophrenia. And he is over 40. And it took it did take a while for the diagnosis. It took about six months for the diagnosis. They thought he had all sorts of things. But, I do think that this entity played a part in it, because. the doctors were so confused. They sat there and they said Oh my God. We don’t understand how somebody can have, can just have schizophrenia out of the blue like this!

And I called his friends who have known him for twenty – thirty –  You know?  They’ve known him for years. And I said, “Hey you know my dad’s not doing well. They think he has schizophrenia. I want to know what do you know about this? And what do you know of my dad when he was younger.”  And they all said the same thing. We don’t know how the heck he would have schizophrenia?  He had no signs? He had no symptoms? He had nothing!

Right. So that to me – and, and this is something that I often say to people, about people diagnosed with mental illnesses. Particularly like your father when they’ve had nothing prior.  And there is genuine mental illness out there. Don’t get me wrong. But, very often it’s not. Or, not very often. Sometimes it’s not. Sometimes it is spirit attachment, or spirit influence, or entity influence in this case. And, and, I tend to feel that in this situation that actually for somebody to have a psychotic break like that –  out of the blue, with no signs building up to it. Nothing like that and the fact doctors are confused as how he could have this, you know, without any other symptoms?  That says to me more, that he was being influenced by this entity and had you guys not perhaps, intervened, then something tragically – something tragic could have happened.  Or, would have happened. And that’s probably what that entity was working towards this whole time.

Right, and there are stories of situations where people have confronted entities and say oh you know mess with me instead. Or, things like that. And there have been tragic incidences because of that. And I mean for me when this stuff happened, I got holy water and I got holy oil, ‘cause, I didn’t know what to do. And I knew that there was some spiritual workings going on here that were not OK.

And even me I thought eech! You know, and I was older but I was only equipped with so much being a Christian, I feel.  Nothing against the faith or anything like that.  But, I feel like I was only equipped with so much.  And so I got my holy oil. I got my holy water. And I said. No! You are not going to mess with me! You are going to stay out of my room! This is my safe space and you will leave me alone. And so that’s something that I did.

And that’s why I feel like I – I got the least of it right and I feel really bad for my my rat who had passed away. And I do think about her from time to time. She was an amazing little rodent.  And I think that was a big wakeup call for me, even though it happened two weeks after. And the whole Ouija board and everything like that had happened.

But all of that I feel had led to my dad going crazy at the way he did.  And my mom is also addicted to opioids. And it’s interesting, because, my cousin was doing heroin. Right. And so my mom is now also doing the you know the pill form of that. And I think that the entity may have grown an attachment to my Mom possibly.  Or to the family in some way and been like hey now, I know I’m with this one person but I can wreak a whole lot of havoc in this household. With a lot of these vulnerable people in here.

Right. That’s what they do isn’t it. Wow. That’s – that’s absolutely tragic. And since your parents moved out of the house is the difference in their behavior. I mean obviously your mom’s still got this addiction and maybe it started. –  Maybe the Gateway was her traumatic brain injury which can take a long time to recover from, and some people never fully do. Maybe that was the gateway for the entity to start influencing your mom?

I agree. I think that that was probably the Gateway. You know? I know that when you have, you know, a mental illness or perhaps when you have some sort of physical ailment like that, you are weakened.  And so your defenses are down.  Spiritually, physically, mentally.

Correct.

And so that’s a great way for the entity to come in and to influence somebody. My mom still takes her medication and abuses her medication unfortunately. However, my dad. And this is so surprising coming from him. He actually recognizes when he is having a mental break and he will call people, and reach out for help. He calls to make sure that he goes to his –  his appointments to see his doctor, his psychiatrist, and his therapist on a regular basis. He takes his medication when he needs to. He was actually just just down here in Colorado. He lives in Alabama right now. And that’s what happened when they had split up. My dad lived in…. My dad went to Alabama.

Oh? So your parents separated as a result of this all?

Yes. So my dad went to Alabama which I think is good, because, they’re working on themselves separately. And my dad also has COPD which is a lung condition. And up here in Colorado it’s more difficult for somebody to breathe. And so I’m happy for him living in Florida. And, my mom is going to retire soon. She’s going to go join him.

That’s great!

So I’m really happy for them. My mom still abuses her pills and we are working on, we’re working on that situation. But my dad like he was here in Colorado and he had to go back to Florida. But before he left he sat down and he said; “Look. I feel like things are not right here.”  Because he has the delusions and stuff like that. And he said, “Things are not working here. I need to go back to Alabama and I think this is the best course of action for me.” And I said you go do it. You go get your meds and you go take care of yourself. And I mean I’m so proud of him. I don’t think he understands.

That’s a big thing for a – a quote ‘schizophrenic’ to recognize and to do something about their situation, when they’re getting bad. That’s a pretty rare thing for them to recognize that they’re actually going into that psychotic state.  You know?

It takes so long for somebody to recognize that and it’s only been a year for him. It’s only been a year.

Yes. It’s pretty impressive.

Yeah it is pretty impressive. So I think he’s starting to become more aware of things, which is really awesome for him and I’m so proud of him. My brother on the other hand I haven’t heard from, in probably two years or so. I’m not entirely sure where he is or what’s gone on with him. Unfortunately, the last time that we had talked there was some physical violence that was involved.  He had pushed me into the wall. He was trying to get some of his stuff out of the house and he was stealing some things. And it was just not a good situation. He’s…. I love him very much.

Oh yeah, of course you do.  I’m very sorry to hear that Michelle.

But he’s, he’s got some work, that he needs to work on. You know, I send him love and light every day!

And what else can you do? What else can you do hon? People have to walk their own path. And, and as much as you love them and want to help them, there’s only so much you can do. And if he’s still being influenced by that entity and there’s a good chance he is, then until he recognizes, then he’s not going to do anything about it is he?

I don’t think that he is. I know he’s with he’s with a girl right now he’s seeing somebody and he’s been with her for like this like three years now or something. But, she also has addictions. And she has a few DUIs now, which is driving under the influence. And you can get into a lot of trouble here for that. Yeah. So he’s he’s got a lot of that going on and he hangs out with a lot of people who are addicted to a lot of different substances and I think it’s because he is too.

And it’s one of those –  you know you don’t want to feel alone. Yeah. You want to hang out with your crowd. His crowd. That’s his path and if that’s his path and that’s what he needs to learn?  And maybe he has something to learn from it. Perhaps this entity really does have a really strong hold on him?  But he does…. From what I’m seeing, the only way to get rid of an entity is if somebody really wants to. If he recognizes that he has an entity.  And if he wants it. There’s nothing anyone can do.

You’re absolutely correct about that. If they want that entity there…. Ah, sometimes it gets a bit like Stockholm syndrome, you know? Like the person becomes used to being in that state and and in some weird psychological way, is almost addicted to it, you know? Yeah. And so again I mean I’ve come across cases in my years where –  one in particular. A lady that was playing with an Ouija board and I talked about that in my Ouija board episode.  She invited these entities. She wanted them.

Yes. I remember that episode.

Yeah. And you just can’t help people who are like that.  You, you can get rid of the entity, but, if they want it there, it’s not going to go. It’s not going to go. You’re wasting your time. Because the person’s will over rides anything else that we could do and it’s just a waste of energy. That’s really sad. So this, this whole episode has absolutely split your family? And, that was the goal of the entity was to divide your family and to destroy it. But it hasn’t destroyed it. So that’s a positive thing. It’s separated it, but you look at how it’s coming back together again, now that you’re out of the house.

Right. I will say that there are some traumas that I personally have. For ex –  for instance, when I first moved out of the house in 2016 I like, I wouldn’t eat and I’d always ask my fiancé. My now fiancé. I’d say Hey can I have some ice cream? Hey can I have this? And he’s like It’s okay if you have food and you don’t need to ask me. And it took me a while to kind of grasp that. And so for me like understanding normal behavior almost – that’s really sad to say.  Well understanding some normal behaviour is kind of hard for me to grasp at sometimes, and just kind of sit there and realize oh so that is that’s a thing that actually happens.

Oh wow. So it traumatized you to that state?  That’s, that’s really…. that’s really horrific to hear that.

It is, because, when I was you know when I was at that age and I would go into my room, and I would say OK be invisible, be invisible. You can only do that for so long until you are invisible. And you feel invisible. Yeah exactly. And so it’s…. Yeah. I feel like we are coming back together and my trauma is healing and the family is healing slowly but we are healing.

Yes. And that’s the positive isn’t it. You are healing. How how long a period of time did this go on for entirely?

Oh gosh it’s been for years. So from the time that I was about eighteen  –  probably six or seven years.

So that’s a long time to be in such an oppressive situation and to deal with something like that. So – and that’s not that long ago that you came out of it. So really I think you’re doing very well. Very, very well.

Yeah. I feel like, I feel like I am.  Especially since you know when I graduated from university and two thousand nineteen, last year. With all that stuff, you know, I’m doing all that stuff at the university and stuff like that. You know I feel like I have come such a long way, and I’ve learned so much from it and my path. I went from being a Christian to being a Wiccan, because, I just felt so much more meaning from it. And, being a Wiccan I was able to really analyze the situation say OK, so this is what happens.

And once I had gotten into the house you know of course I saged myself. I was like There’s no, nothing attached. You’re not allowed to be attached to me any more. You’re not allowed to be around me you’re not allowed to influence me. You are not here. This is my body. This is my house and this is my life!

Awesome, so you absolutely took back control. Well done!  I’ve got goose-bumps. That’s awesome! That’s so awesome! So even though it was such a devastating time for you all as a family and for you personally, there’s light at the end the tunnel. And good things can come out of negative situations. Even if it’s just learning about your own strengths and your own abilities.

Yes, good things can come out of these situations and I will say during this stuff we had a –  we had a dog. We still have her actually. But she went through a lot of stuff too with the entity and with all this negativity you know she was losing weight and she was attacked by another dog during this. And so me and my fiancé say we’ve actually adopted her now and she’s ours. And we kind of consider our house her retirement home. She has an amazing life right now. She’s walked every single day. She gets treats she takes CBD oil for her arthritis and nobody believes me but she’s 17 years old. And, I feel like I rescued her from the situation and she’s just thriving. Oh my God.

That’s awesome, that’s awesome. And of course, she’s a family member.

Of course she is! And so I feel like there’s light at the end of the tunnel even if it’s just a dog being rescued or just yourself or anything. There is always light, and there’s always hope. And you know you just gotta keep living to the next day. Right. And even though I don’t talk to my brother any more, I’m glad that he chose to keep living till the next day.

Yeah, absolutely. And that’s a hard –  so many people so many people struggle with that. And it’s really really hard. And depression is a very, very difficult thing to deal with. And when it’s exacerbated by outside influence, it’s a double whammy. I can just imagine how suffocating he must’ve felt to, to turn to other means of escape. Yeah. It’s really, really really hard.  Okay so so for you now looking back on it, what are the things that your experience taught you? What sort of words of wisdom would you have to share with anybody who may be going through something similar?

I would say that you’re not alone. One hundred percent. You’re not alone. And I would. I feel like I did the right steps you know? Getting that entity even if it’s just out of your room. You know, and recognizing that, that is something that is happening you’re not crazy.  You know there’s a lot of gas-lighting that went on. There’s a lot of emotional abuse. It’s not just like physical abuse, it’s emotional abuse that actually happened. And I would just say it’ll be OK. And to keep living on to the next day. ‘Cause, there is light at the end of the tunnel, there really is.  

It’s pretty amazing. Did you ever hear about your cousin who happened to your cousin? Is she still around?

She had gone to some AA meetings. She had gone to some rehabilitation centers, but like you said if you don’t want to get better, you’re not going to get better. I know that she’s wanted in several states now including Colorado because we –  she did end up stealing quite a bit of money from us. She’s stolen about ten thousand dollars from us. I don’t know how much that is. I don’t know how much that is in New Zealand dollars, unfortunately. She’s stolen even fifty thousand dollars from her parents. And so she is wanted in a few states and we don’t know where she is currently. Unfortunately, she’s evaded police a lot.

Wow it’s incredibly sad isn’t it? It’s very sad but you can’t do anything about choices people make.

No, you can’t. It’s it’s just really sad because we grew up together, and she was my best friend growing up. You know, I’m preparing for my wedding right now and I’m looking at old pictures, you know, so I’m getting ready for the reception and stuff.

Well congratulations hon, that’s awesome!

Thank you. I’m so excited.

When are you getting married?

October fifth.

That’s not that far away. How exciting for you. Something positive, and it sounds to me like you have wonderful emotional support with your fiancé now. Somebody who really loves you, and respects you. And, honors your journey.

Yeah he does. He doesn’t really understand the Wiccan ways.

But he accepts you regardless.

He goes, you do what you need to do sweetheart.

Oh that’s lovely.

Yeah a lot of positive things have come out of it. We’re going to be trying for a baby soon and we’re very excited.

Oh that’s wonderful. Oh well I’m so thrilled to hear that out of such a negative time. Your life is turned around and now, you know, things are really looking up for you.

They are! They’re really looking up and I keep saying, you know, if I can get through that time that happened, during those years, those six years. I can get through anything. I really can! And I feel like people are stronger than we think that they are. You know we’re stronger. I’m stronger than I think that I am. And I’m a lot stronger than I was back then to, ‘cause, back then I was trying to be invisible. And now here I am on a podcast and I’m saying here, see me world. This happened!

Yeah. What a turn around eh! It’s absolutely wonderful. Michelle thank you so much for your time. It’s been an absolute pleasure having you and listening to your story. And, I really appreciate you taking the time to share your experiences with myself and with my audience. I know that they were very traumatic for you and that it was a very difficult time in your life. So speaking out about this actually takes a lot of courage and I applaud you for that and I thank you for your time today.

Yeah, thank you for having me on the show. I really enjoyed talking with you about it, and this is actually my first time speaking out about it. I’m very happy that it was here.

You did really well and I know it’s a, it’s a difficult thing to talk about. People don’t realize on this they’ve experienced the sort of thing themselves. How hard it is to talk about because you never know how people are going to respond. So a lot of people who have these sort of experiences, keep them to themselves for this reason, because, they don’t know. How people are going to take it, whether they’re going to be laughed at or ridiculed or you know? So it’s a very brave thing for you to do Michelle and thank you so much.

Thank you.

This entity that came into Michelle’s previously normal family’s life, came in with her cousin – attached to her cousin, and almost immediately began causing division and strife within her family. Did the entity cause her Mum’s accident and the death of her beloved rat? I don’t know about that, I do know that the timing is very suspect – and certainly in her Mum’s case it opened the door for the entity to influence her Mums addiction to heroin based prescription medication, which she still struggles with to this day. And which her cousin was heavily addicted to. In fact was using in their home – unbeknown to the family for some time.

It most definitely targeted her younger brother and influenced his drug use – he of them all was the most vulnerable in the family – although it worked on all of them, to one degree or another. Michelle has not seen her brother in a number of years and does not know where he currently is in the States, or if he is still using – Although my suspicion would be that he is, unless he has been able to get rid of that entity from his life.

And it most certainly influenced her dad, who developed schizophrenic patterns of thought and behaviour – hearing voices telling him things. Encouraging him to acts of violence and inducing paranoid thought patterns.  He was subsequently diagnosed with schizophrenia.  This was something that really baffled his psychiatrists, because that is a disease that is not seen developing in people over 45. Generally, people develop symptoms of schizophrenia, between the ages of sixteen to thirty years old. Not at his age, and certainly not without any prior symptoms.

His friends of twenty and thirty plus years were completely dumfounded when Michelle approached them and asked if he had ever displayed any symptoms during the years they had know him. He had not. So this begs the question – was this all influenced by the entity who caused so much havoc in this family and their lives? Michelle herself was not left unscathed by this all and for many years had post-traumatic stress and only now is really at a stage where she is healed enough to be able to talk about it. Even the family pets were not immune to the influence of this entity.

Were things exacerbated by the girlfriend of Michelle’s brother and her spiritual practices? Or by the use of the Ouija board? I am certain, that it likely didn’t help in any case. It’s very interesting to note, that when people were away from the home, they felt differently – things seemed to be normal again, until they returned home where their cousin was. Even Michelle’s college friends who would come to her home noticed the negative, heavy, atmosphere in the house.

Ultimately this caused the family to all split and go their separate ways, which is incredibly sad, but I feel was part of the goal of the entity to begin with. The good news, is that Michelle’s Mum and Dad are looking at getting back together and the three of them are working on their relationships again, and hopefully one day Michelle will once again be in contact with her brother and they can mend that relationship.

But for now, Michelle has a wonderful partner who loves her, and they are planning their marriage and already looking forward to having a family together. And she’s looking forward to a great future with her partner. How awesome for her, that she now has some positivity in her life.

I really want to thank Michelle for being so kind as to share her story with us all. I know it was hard for her, it was hard for me to hear some of it. But I am so grateful that she did and I wish her and her family nothing but love and peace moving forward.

Our bumper music today is called Abysmal by Bryant Lowry

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