Episode 134: Metacomputics

Welcome to another episode of the Walking the Shadowlands podcast, where we dive deep into the mysteries of reality and explore cutting-edge theories that challenge our understanding of the universe. I’m your host, Marianne. Today’s episode is particularly special, as it marks a continuation from one of our most popular episodes from the very first season of the podcast, titled ‘A Glitch in the Matrix, a Holographic Reality?’ And still to this day, one of our most listened to episodes.

We are joined by a remarkable individual whose theories have been generating quite a buzz. Our guest today is Dr Simon Duan, a former material scientist turned spiritual explorer, shares his journey from China to Cambridge and how encounters with the paranormal led him to the theory of the metacomputer.

Tracing back the simulation hypothesis, Dr Duan introduces the Platonic computer, a non-physical entity in the realm of forms proposed by Plato. He challenges traditional scientific methods, proposing a paradigm shift in our understanding of computation and reality.

So, are you prepared to walk with me into this part of the shadowlands, on a mind-bending journey with Dr Simon Duan deep into the darkness of the unknown and see what awaits us there? Let’s begin.

Dr Simon Duan

Dr Simon Duan is the founder and CEO of Metacomputics Labs. He came from China to the UK to study in the 1980s.  After receiving a PhD in Materials Science from Cambridge University, he worked in research and development, technology commercialisation and management consultancy in both the UK and China. He has long-standing interests in paranormal research and is a past vice president of the Chinese Parapsychology Association.


Marianne: Firstly, Simon, thank you so much for agreeing to talk with us today. I’ve actually been really looking forward to our conversation since you first contacted me because, you were really a follow on from one of my podcast episodes I did in the beginning of my podcast journey called, ‘A glitch in the matrix, a holographic reality’.

And this episode will be in season 12. That episode is still in my top ten most listened to episodes, because it really resonates with people. So, I’m really excited about hearing your theories and your information. Perhaps you could tell us a little bit about yourself and your background.

Dr Duan: Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Thank you, Marianne, for having me. You mentioned the episode on the glitch of matrix. I actually listened to that one. And I was very impressed with the quality you made actually. Yeah. So I urge listeners who haven’t listened to that episode, please go ahead to do it. It’s excellent episode. I think there’s two actually. You made two.

Yes. One was just people’s experiences.

Yeah. Yeah. That’s also fantastic. There’s real case studies of people who actually experienced those glitches in Matrix. And the research you have done is very thorough. It’s very professional.

Oh, thank you.

I came to the UK in 80s as a student. I was born and did my primary and secondary education in China before I came to UK, as a student. I finished my PhD in material science, from Cambridge University.

That was in the end of eighties. Then I worked in industry for more than two decades. And, I’m supposed to be a materialist. My PhD is in material science. But actually, I became interested in spirituality. So, the trigger for that is some encounters in paranormal. Personal encounter of paranormal experiences, which triggered my interest in looking something else beyond material science. So that’s my journey. It’s like a rabbit hole. Once you start looking to paranormal, it doesn’t stop. Fascinates you.

It really does. And I agree.

That’s right. Yeah. And, so I have been really fascinated by all the encounters and because once you start, you keep looking for more and more. And you get more and more fascinated about the phenomenon I encounter. My business, take me back to China regularly. So, I got involved with Chinese parapsychology research circle. And we have conferences from time to time. And more importantly, we invite people who have psychic abilities to come to talk. And to demonstrate. And also. I spend all my spare time visiting those people who have ability. Or who have experience of encounter in the matrix. So that’s my personal passion, basically, as well as the fascination. I’m also get bothered, because, I’m naturally curiosity person, right? I’m full of curious curiosity. And, from my childhood, one of the, my favorite book is, ten thousand Why’s. Is a Chinese series book to explain why is this? Why is this? Basically, it’s a popular science book, but it answers why questions. I always want to ask why? And, When I come across paranormal, it always bothers me. I couldn’t answer it, why this happens? How this happens? So, it’s like an intellectual itch I need to scratch.

That’s a good description and you can never quite reach that itch, can you?

Yeah, and therefore I have also been trying to develop a model. Trying to explain it. The best model I come across up to now is the presumption that the universe is a matrix. And we are actually living in the matrix. This is the only way I can find so that we can explain all these paranormals and parapsychologies and psychic abilities and mishaps and glitches.

So, it was really out of resonance with your research as well. Because you mentioned, and this is the way to explain all this.

Yes, and it’s really, it’s a subject that absolutely fascinates me, like you. It’s that itch that you just can’t quite scratch. And you just want to know more and more and more and more.

Okay, so perhaps you can, explain to us what metacomputics is, and why you chose this term to describe the theory that you’ve come up with.

To model the universe as a simulation is not actually new. A German computer scientist Carl Rossi. He was the first one actually to propose this idea. He postulated that there’s a big computer which runs the universe. Yeah. As a computer scientist, I can understand why he says this because if you have a hammer and everywhere you look, you see nails. As a computer scientist, is quite natural for him to think, Oh, maybe the universe is a processing output of computation? And so, he actually talked about this as early as 1969.

Another major heavyweight scholar is John Wheeler. This is another famous physicist. He actually coined the term black hole. Oh? Right! In the universe, black hole. So, he proposed a very famous now phrase. It’s called ‘it from bit’. Yeah. It means physical things, physical universe, and bit is the information. And they said, everything has information in the background. So, information is the fundamental reality and the appearance of physical universe is dependent on information embedded beneath it. He proposed this phrase in 1990, actually. And of course, the idea got very popularized with the movie Matrix.

And so, Matrix was a very successful movie on itself. But it introduced to mass population, this idea that the universe can be seen as a matrix. So, this increased a lot of awareness of this possibility, but also some serious thinkers, scholars. including physicists as well as cosmologists, biologists, philosophers, as well as technology leaders.

They have been considering seriously whether this is a real possibility. But most people actually stay at the stage of speculation. They speculate. Oh, this might be a matrix. Yeah. But to me, as a scientist, speculation is not enough. So, the progress further from speculation to a theory.

You need to answer a number of questions. For example, if the universe is a processing output of computation, and then the first question you should answer is, where is the computer? What is made of? How is it built? And what are its properties? Of course, another big, important question is who is the programmer?

So, I think unless you answer all those questions, it stays as a speculation. It cannot be a scientific theory. Right. It cannot even be a hypothesis. Some people call it simulation hypothesis. I don’t think it has got to that stage yet. Most people speculate. Yeah, of course they have a lot of evidence as you gathered from your podcast.

People have a lot of glitches and those evidence. supporting this hypothesis. But as a scientific theory, you need more. You need to answer all those questions. So, people have been trying to answer those questions. For example, the Oxford philosopher Professor Nick Bostrom. He proposed the so-called ancestor argument.

Basically, he is saying that the computer which produced this matrix is in the future. Right. Because of the technology will continue to develop. At some stage, the computer will be so powerful it can produce virtual reality, which is indistinguishable from the physical reality.

Therefore, the future generation, the future advanced civilization will have curiosity about how their ancestor live their lives. Therefore, they would simulate how their ancestors has been living in the past. And we are actually their ancestors. Ah, interesting. Brilliant. Yeah, so that’s his proposition.

Basically, the computer is in the future. but I don’t think that’s a reasonable proposition because I think no matter how the advanced computer is, it can still produce only virtual reality, right? It cannot produce the physical reality. To produce physical reality, the computer needs to be outside the universe.

It cannot be inside the universe. It’s like our virtual game. The virtual game isn’t actually in this physical universe. It’s a parallel universe. Yeah. To my mind, the computer that produced this physical universe has to be outside this universe. Outside the space and time. So instead of look further into the future, I choose to look vertically.

And I choose to look vertically into the transcendental place. So, I don’t assume the computer is a physical. I presume the computer is transcendental. It’s non-physical. And if it’s a transcendental, it’s not in this space. It’s not this, it’s a physical universe.

It’s outside this physical universe. So, the place I have found to locate this computer is the realm of forms. proposed by Plato. Now Plato proposed that there is realm of forms, which contains the essence of all the physical things. Abstract entities, like concepts. Like numbers. And the physical things are only shadow a poor imitation of this ideal form, in the realm of forms. For example, we have a various-dogs of various shapes and forms and colours. Different species of dog. But in the platonic realm of forms, there is a dogness, the abstract dog form. The abstract dog form is the essence of all the physical dogs. The physical dogs of all the sizes and shapes are actually a poor copy of this ideal dog.

So, based on this same principle, I speculate, postulate, that because we have a physical computer here, and we ought to have a perfect. abstract computer in the realm of forms. I call it platonic computer. So, the platonic computer is in the realm of forms and its output, it’s the physical universe. So that’s my sort of contribution to this field. I actually locate this computer in the realm of forms as a transcendental non-physical computer. So, this is my contribution, basically.

That’s really interesting.  What you’re saying is that there is this reality that is forms and shapes? But not solid? Is that right?

Yes, that’s right.

So, if there is this meta computer there, then that means that there have to be beings that control it. Or feed it information. Would that be a fair comment?

Yeah, yeah, it is. Yeah, the computer is non-physical. And also, the beings who feed it and operate it, the feeding information, is also non-physical. However, those beings at the higher level of existence, are not somebody else. It’s ourself also.

Oh, so you’re referring to like the over self? Is that how some people?

Yeah, yeah. Some people would refer it as a higher self. Yeah. In my model, we as a human exist in all levels of creation. Physical level is one of many levels. And so, we have a physical body. At another level of reality, we don’t have a physical body, but we have a non-physical form. But it’s also ourself. We have a higher self at all levels of reality. And it is our higher self who actually made the non-physical computer and operate the physical computer. At the same time act as a player for this avatar at the lower level. Does that make sense?

Yes, it does. And it fits in with a lot of older world philosophies, doesn’t it?

Yes, that’s right. Yeah. It’s like a various dog form, physical dog forms. They have a common dogness. But also we as a human, we also share some higher forms of ourselves. So, it converges when you go up. And so that higher self are normally shared by many individuals. But still, it’s our self, higher self.

And in some tradition, they might refer that as deities. Right. But deities, not somebody else. It’s ourself. It’s our higher self. Those beings, they operate the non-physical computer. And they produce this lower-level universe. Just like us. Right? We the physical computer to manipulate the physical computer, to produce the virtual reality, which is another level, lower level of parallel universe.

Very interesting. Can you elaborate on the differences between the scientific methodology used in physics, and the approach you propose for metacomputics? How do these differences impact our understanding of computation and the nature of reality?

Yeah, it is a different approach to the traditional scientific approach. But it’s not all natural. I mean, science itself progresses. Yeah. And sometimes they call it paradigm shift. So, the science itself also develops. And in science we model the reality. And the models are normally based on metaphors.

So basically, it’s like we try to find out what elephants like. But we cannot see the elephant. We are blind people. We can’t see the elephant. We’re trying to work out what does the elephant look like? And some people would describe the elephant as a pillar. And some other people would describe the elephant as a wall. And another person, a blind person, may describe the elephant as a tube. Because they cannot see the elephant, they have to rely on metaphors to understand. And to describe, pillars, wall, and rope, and the tubes are metaphors.

Help people to understand and to describe to other people. In science, we are doing the same. So, in mechanicals time, in Newton’s time, we have a good metaphor, which is the machine. And at that time, the most advanced machines are clocks and watches. So, we describe the universe as a clock-like machine.

Newton’s laws, a set of equations described dynamics of the macro-objects, including planets. So, we model the universe, especially the macro universe as a clock like machine. Because, that’s the best metaphor we can find. Yes. human society was electrified. We had a new concept called electricity. So, we use this concept to model the micro universe as electrically charged particles. This new client is positively charged, electron is negative, charged particle. So, it’s based on another metaphor, which is electricity. Up To now, the most scientific approach are based on those two metaphors.

Of course, they use a lot of mathematics to model those dynamics of particles as well as the planets. Right. And so now we moved into the information age. We have new metaphors those metaphors are computers. Big data. Information. Virtual reality. Artificial intelligence. All those new metaphors are inspiring us to come up with new models of reality.

So, the simulation hypothesis, the matrix, are new metaphors based on which we can build new model of the reality. that’s what we are talking about now. So, it’s a different matter for based model of reality. we don’t have to believe those models. Because the model may be just one of the aspects of reality.

It’s like a pillar. It’s like one of the legs in elephant or the trunks of elephant. Yeah. So, we don’t have to take it as a reality. But it’s a powerful tool you can use to model reality. To understand reality. To direct our sort of lives based on the model. To answer your question, it’s a different metaphor based on approach. And we don’t have to judge which is right. Which is wrong.

As I said, it’s a model. It’s not the reality. We judge model as a tool. Yeah. So, the more tool we have, the more effective we become. Like when you play golf you would prefer a set of tools. Set of clubs, instead of only one. In New Zealand, I’m sure you have a big garden. When you do garden. I mean, you prefer to have multiple different tools instead of only one tool. So, by adding simulation hypothesis, we add another tool set into the science. We expand the science. Because it provides a new tool to deal with the now-known. To make predictions, to understand the reality from a different lens.

So scientific model can be also seen as a lens. Of which you can see different aspect of reality. Like when you have a telescope, you can see in the sky a lot further. And when you have a microscope, you can see very small things much better. So, with the simulation hypothesis, we can see the universe, see the reality from a different lens. Which is actually very helpful. Because like you mentioned in your podcast, many things which cannot be explained with the existing scientific theories now can be explained. Yeah. Including the paranormal.

Yes. Absolutely. And actually, I’m a medium. And I’ve had a lot of contact with extra-terrestrial beings my entire life. So, I come from a different perspective. But they taught me this stuff. Which is why I have such a fascination for it. And I remember one time. I may have mentioned this in one podcast episode, but I can’t quite remember. I had this experience that they showed me this vision. I was sitting on this park bench when they were trying to explain realities to me.

I was sitting on this park bench with this being talking. And then all of a sudden, this huge pair of hands came down. And picked me up and I realized I was in the hands of a little child and he put me in his pocket and then that expanded out to another vision, then to another vision, then to another vision. It was like, like this reality was the core of an onion and each layer was a different reality around.

Yeah. Yeah. It’s a fascinating. Yeah. I, I love to catch up again offline, off this interview. Because I love to talk to people like you, and I learn a lot from them. All my research have been done through talking to people like you.

Oh, really?

Because, because I’m not psychic. I don’t have a lot of spiritual experiences. However, I love to talk to people who have. And they teach me a hell of a lot. So, all the information. All the inspiration, are from people like you.

We’re always learning, eh? It’s a constant thing. We never stop learning. I asked my people, why didn’t they tell me this before? And they said, well, you weren’t ready for that understanding before. You weren’t mature enough to handle it. Now you are. And it just expanded on the knowledge that they had been teaching me since I was three.

Oh, I see. Okay. Fascinating.

So that really has been my life path this whole time, is walking down this way. And part of the reason of my podcast is to, at the very least, start people questioning about the nature of reality. And what we perceive this reality… and like I say, in the glitch in the matrix episode, you know, this chair that we’re sitting on feels solid. I think I said it in that? But it’s not. It’s a bunch of atoms vibrating at a high rate, but we perceive it as being solid.

Yes, yes, exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

Yeah. I read your abstract. Is that what it’s called that you published?  On your theory.

Yeah, I published a few papers peer reviewed the terms.

Yeah, which one did I read? Let me just see. I’ve got it sitting here. It was with a group of a whole pile of others. And I have to say, I had to read it a few times because I’m not very good with numbers. So going over your numbers was a bit of a thing for me. I can’t find the page that it’s… Anyway, it’s one that’s linked from your website.

Ah, okay.

And you’ve got some really interesting diagrams in there that explain what you’re talking about. But you have some bits in there that I’d like to – let me just find it here while I’m talking. Okay, so you say this:

In order to experience creation in space and in time, metaconsciousness constructs multiple living beings in the multiverse via metacomputation. Metaconsciousness then fragments itself into multiple individual conscious agents and localizes each individual consciousness within each living being. This gives rise to the sense of individual subjectivity, which we’ve already talked about.

But then, you go on to talk about how, as a living being exists in space and time, each individual consciousness agent perceives the universe, from the point of view of the individual living being. It means that. I really like the analogy you use of the relationship between meta consciousness and individual consciousness being likened to the television broadcaster in this control room. And, and how he can see all the different television sets around him.

Yeah. Yes. Give different viewpoints.

That’s a really, I, I brought that up because for some people who are listening to us, they might be, it might be clearer for them to grasp the concept by using that analogy. So, there’s one controller sitting in the room surrounded by all these TV sets that give him a different viewpoint of that reality as it stands at that point in time. Really good metaphor. I really like that.

Yeah. I think everything comes from one consciousness. I call it the meta-consciousness. And the individual consciousness fragmentation of that meta-consciousness. And the meta-consciousness is non local. Because it’s not in space. Whereas individual consciousness depend on this body. And our body has a location in space. And the time, and therefore we have different perspective of the reality which we can contribute to the overall consciousness experience of matter consciousness, which ultimately is our true self anyway.

So, it’s really like a game in some respects that this higher meta consciousness is playing with itself, trying to experience all different aspects of being.

Yes. exactly. Yeah. I define meta consciousness as a power. Power to be self-aware. So, it has a subjectivity. Yeah. I, I am before I am this, I am that. So, it’s power to be self-aware. Power to create. And power to perceive. So, this power in order to express its creativity. It creates diversity. And it creates diversity through computation. because that’s easiest, most effective way to make a creation.

I think, because all you need to do is a binary. And once you have a binary, you can create a computer. Because the computer is basically binary states, two states. On and off. Once you have a binary, you can configure these two states into a computer. And also, if you have two states, you can compose data.

Data stream is basically zeros once. And two, space. Also, you can run the programs with binary. Machine language still zeros once. So, with this binary, you can create anything. And which we know now with the computer, we can produce almost anything, even with a physical computer. And then I imagine the true form of computation, which is not physical. Which is not restricted by physical limitations. How powerful can it be?

Therefore, the metaconsciousness creates diversity. Including many levels of creation. Many levels, parallel universe. And many beings – non-physical beings. With non-physical bodies. As well as the physical beings with the physical bodies. And those beings provide different perspective. Therefore, the meta-consciousness through those avatars can experience its own creation.

It’s very interesting. I once was shown… my star people took me out one time way, way, way, way out and they showed me how universes were created. And they showed me the different dimensional as like plates on top of each other. They were stacked like pancakes. And they showed me that to go from one of these plates to another, you went through like a black hole. I see. To travel from one, multiverse to another multiverse. And there were countless, countless of these.

Oh, Beautiful. Yeah. Have you written down those kinds of realizations?

No, no, I just…

yeah, to me they are valuable. They are valuable for people, like me, if you’re doing research. If I’m doing research, I would love to see some revelations from different people. And this is a beautiful revelation. It resonates with a lot of tradition, actually.

Oh? does it?

Yeah, a lot of traditions describe the creation as a multi layered structure.

Wow, I didn’t know that.

Oh yeah, in Indian tradition, in Chinese tradition, they all have many layers of existence. Many, they call it planes. Planes of existence. Yeah,

That’s what they called it too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They called it – these beings called it universal planes is what they called it. Yeah, yeah.  And to go from one plane to another plane you need to go through black hole because black hole is a distortion for space and time.

Yeah, each level existence have a different time. So, you cannot go easily transition from one to the other, unless the time changes. Because each level’s reality, have a different clock speed. The flow speed of time is different.

Right. Of course.

Yeah. So, if you are in a high level of creation the time flows slower, actually. You can spend one day in the heaven, and in the earth is probably one year. So, there’s a time difference. So, the reason why this time flows differently is because the internal clock of a computer is different. So, the multi-level of creation, i. e. the different planes, are produced by the computer operating at a different clock speed.

Really interesting.

Each clock speed produces a different level of the universe. Right. Multiverse. Yeah, in my model, each universe, each parallel universe. are created by the platonic computer operating at a different clock speed

Very interesting. How has your theory, how has it been accepted by the general scientific community? Have you had much feedback?

Yeah, general scientific community, they are kind of, uh not ready. Put it that way. They are not ready. All the people who have interests are those people who have a spiritual experiences. Right, who cannot make sense of the experiences. And so those people are interested in alternative way of looking at the world.

Then they are getting interested in the matrix hypothesis. And they’re also interested in explaining their experiences. And those kind of people will be interested in the work we are doing. And also, for spiritual people who want to progress further. And I think some people would love to get out of the matrix. Yeah, they realize this is a prison.

It is a prison.

100%. Yeah, and therefore, based on this realization, they would love to seek a way out of it. To be free. and in that case, for those people, this theory, this framework can act as a roadmap. Because if, this is a matrix a prison, if you want to get out of the matrix, you should understand how this matrix is made.

Correct! Yeah. Absolutely!

How is it structured? And therefore, you can find out the way out. So, for those kinds of people my model can be used as a guide. As a roadmap and they can locate themselves. Locate themselves in the matrix. Right. And then they can go from there. It’s like a roadmap. Yeah. You, you need to know where you are. You need to know where you are going to go. And you need to find a way. from A to B. And so, this theory, this model act as a roadmap. Because it does explain the different level of reality. How it’s created. What are its properties. And how you can get from one level to the other. That is a good hint I just mentioned, is the time. And if you want to go from one to go on another level, you need to manage time, People call it vibration.

Vibration and frequency. Yeah. That’s something that my star people always taught me about. The importance of vibration and frequency.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, vibration and the frequency are related to the clock speed. Related to the refresh rate of the computer.

Oh, interesting,

Right? So then, at each level, because each level of the reality are created by different clock speed. They all have a different refresh rate of the display. And that refresh rate is related to the vibration frequency very interesting.

Very, very interesting. Wow, I’m really enjoying this conversation, Simon. It’s yeah, it’s really great. I have a question. You assert in your paper that you put out that the metacomputics model is not a description of reality. Can you explain the relationship between your theory and the, is it a philosopher, Immanuel Kant’s? Perspective on the unknowability of the universe? Yeah. How does that tie in with his theory? Or doesn’t it?

Yeah, it does. It does. Kant is one of my favourite philosopher and according to him, the true nature of the universe, a true nature of anything, actually, in universe is not knowable. Yeah. Because we have to rely on our senses. And the sense distort the reality. Yeah. Yes. It’s like a pair of coloured glasses you can’t take off. So, we always see the reality as a filtered, as a distorted picture. Not the true picture. So therefore, he postulates that because we cannot take these glasses off, we cannot, we will never be able to know the reality.

However, in science. We can hypothesis. . Scientific model is actually hypothesis. Yeah. Although we cannot know the reality, we can make the best guess. Right. Like what I said, we used to make a best guess of the universe as a machine. And then we made the best guess at the time. The universe is charged particles.

Now we are able to make another guess. Which is a new model of reality. Based on that the universe is information. And therefore, the true nature of the information, according to the count is not knowable. We can hypothesis it as information. Basically, it’s, like a barcode. Right. Barcode is information. Yes. And it doesn’t make sense unless you process it. It’s a computer. It doesn’t mean anything. It’s just random code. But that’s the true reality. But through processing, you can decode the information. Then you get some picture of the universe. So, this is one way I can model the so-called unknowable, true nature of reality.

So basically, it’s a code?


That’s so interesting. And I often have thought, for people like myself who, have psychic abilities like one of my biggest abilities is claircognizance. I just know things. I just know it and I don’t know where I get that information. It’s just, I know it and it’s never incorrect and I’ve speculated that people like myself have the ability to tap into that computer. Into that program and pick up the information from there.

Yeah. I agree. You are one of the people I talked to and they told me how they actually access information. So, I would interpret that ability as a weakened consciousness at another level.

Oh Interesting.

Yeah. I Because we all have a different degree of awakening. Like what I described, the creation is a multi-planed reality.


We exist at all levels. But for most people, they are not awakened at other levels. They only operate on the physical level. Yes. And therefore, they have limited access to information. So, for some people, they actually act as NPC. In computer game. We have a term called NPC, non-playable character. Yeah. So those characters, they don’t have a player. They’re like fillers for the scene.

Like, here in, in reality, I would describe them as people without souls. They’re just there to fill the gaps and provide background for the players.

Oh, yes, that’s exactly, exactly. Yeah. Because they act as a pre-programmed being. Yeah. So, they’re controlled by a set of programs. they react according to the situation. And they don’t have a player to change their program.


So, some people at the low end of the spectrum act as NPC. They just react to situation. If you beat them, they beat you back. They score you back. So, it’s, reactive. And at other levels, they have their players are weakened. Players are not in the physical level. Players at another level. It’s like a wii when we play a computer game. We are player, the avatar inside the computer game. At this physical level. Some people have their player at another level, higher level. Awakened. they can be more active. Those people are difficult to predict. because they’re not always follow the program. They follow some, they don’t always follow all the programs. And so those people depend on their state of awakening. Some of them can actually access the database. because the computer is none physical, at our physical level. And they themselves are awakened at that level also. Therefore, they have access to the database of the computer.

That’s a really interesting way of describing it.

Yeah, so by accessing the database, they can acquire all kinds of information effortlessly. They may not be aware, but they actually have access to it. So, the information get, it’s like, download.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Download. That’s sometimes what it feels like to me. Honestly, it feels like I just all of a sudden, it’s this whoosh of information. That’s just right there. And I’m like, where did that come from? Where did that come from?

Yeah. Because you are awakened on another level.  Your higher self is active, basically. And it’s not everybody. And I think for you, for other peoples, the higher self is active. And the activity include access to the database.


Some activity of the higher self also include manipulate the program. Ah, yes. If you can change the program, change the code, you can do magic things. You can do miracles; you can do paranormal things. Because basically, if everything is processing output of computation, if you can get into the computer to change the code, anything can happen. And, I come across people who can move object. Move physical object. Yeah. From one location to another.

Oh, wow. That’s interesting.

I think. all they do is actually to change the location data. if you change the location data, x and y, z, then the object is, is in another place. You don’t need to physically transport it. You just change the data.

That’s really interesting. This is such a fascinating topic. And, it was the first season of my podcast that I did that glitch in the matrix. And this is such a great follow on. And more information for my listeners to digest and think. And at the very least, if it causes them to question, that’s an awesome thing. That’s an awesome thing. Because the more people that question, the more. Oh, I hate that term, but there’s no other term – awake people become. And aware of what’s actually happening around them. And then, things that are happening in the world don’t bother you so much. Because you realize that really, it’s just a program working itself out.

Yes, that’s exactly, that’s exactly right. And we create all sorts of trouble because of ignorance. Yeah. Because we don’t realize this avatar is not our true self.


Yeah. Our true self is the matter consciousness at the top. And also, our true self, higher self at all level of reality, all level of consciousness. And the higher you go, the more integrated we are. Therefore we become one, eventually. It’s, everybody is one eventually. As I said, individual are fragmentation of the one. Because people don’t realize, that they identify themselves as the avatar. Yeah.

Yes, correct.

And that’s where the trouble, that’s become ego, egoistic. And also at the same time, because they come from the one. They come from the almighty. They come from the being which create everything. So automatically the higher self have everything. But when we come down to this level as individual avatar, we still remember we should have everything, but we don’t. We have a scarcity. We have a fear. That’s why we want to grab. We want to grab material possession so that we feel safer. And we want to grab land. Right. To do that, we have to have walls so if we realize everyone is one. And we are not this reality. We are not this avatar. We are actually the higher being. We can eliminate lots of the troubles in this world.

Yes, absolutely. And make a huge difference. I had an experience about five or six years ago, Where I consciously travelled into different dimensions. There was seven of them, seven, I believe. And in each dimension, I went, there was another version of me. But I looked different. My body shape was different.


And as I went into each version. I integrated with that being. Or, that being integrated into me. Yeah. And then when I came back all the beings integrated into me. They kind of joined with me. And it was like, for the first time, I felt whole again.


Yeah. Really interesting experience.

Yeah. Very profound insight also. Yeah, feel whole again. Yeah, because the separation make us unwhole. Yeah, make us lacking. We have to seek from somewhere else. And sadly, we seek it from material. Which cause more trouble, of course.

That’s a very, a really deep, understanding of why humans behave the way they do. From a totally different perspective. And explains a lot, actually. In my opinion, explains a lot. So, how has all this knowing, Simon, affected your day-to-day reality? Have you, after coming to this profound understanding, through your research and your study and your computations. How has this made a difference to you on a day-to-day level? Has it? I presume it has. It can’t not have.

Yeah. Of course, living in this reality, we need to obey the laws of this reality. And so, I cannot change gravity, for example, Although some people can. Yeah, some people can. By the way, gravity is just a program. And that’s another way to look at the physical reality. And the apple falls because it’s programmed to fall the 9. 8 meters per second square is just the parameter, in that program.

Oh right!

Yeah. So therefore, it’s a program. And processing output of that program is a free-falling-objects. So, if you can get into the program and you can suspend that programme. That’s why some people can levitate and effortlessly. And then because they can suspend that program temporarily. Yeah. For most people like me, we, live the life normally. And we still play the game according to the rule of the game. And I still have to work. I still have to make a living. I still have to pay mortgage. I still have to pay all the bills. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I still have to behave normally to interact with people in the society.

But inside. I no longer have fear. That’s a big one. Yeah, I don’t fear anymore. I know it’s a game. We are playing this avatar. And the true self have everything. True self have abundance. Even we play the poor people. It’s only temporary. it’s like, Prince Harry, Prince Harry late Queen’s second son. When he was a teenager, he used to stay outside to experience of homeless. For a few nights in the street in London. Because, he wants to experience what’s it like to be homeless. Wow. But inside he doesn’t suffer. He knows this experience. I, myself actually have a home. Which is Buckingham Palace. But on the street, I experience what’s it like to be homeless.

So, in this materiality, even I don’t have much money, not, I don’t fear to be poor because I know the true self, myself, have everything. Right. Of course, you also realize we are one. Ultimately, we are one. There’s no point to be nasty to another version of yourself. So, if you don’t have a fear, you don’t want to be nasty to other people. You become a happy life, your life is more relaxed and happier.

And that certainly goes along with a lot of older teachings, like, Buddhism and some of the. Indian beliefs about, you know, just, it’s been there. The truth has been there the whole time. Yeah, yeah. With the old teachings.

That’s right.

It got lost. It got lost for a lot of people. They lost that knowledge but it’s really, it is a game.

 And yeah, it is a game. However, you shouldn’t just treat it carelessly. No. Because even this place is not our true home. It’s a temporary home. We shouldn’t trash it. It’s like you, go to another place temporarily. You live in a hotel. Right? You’re going to move on. Yeah. This is not permanent place. You’re going to move on. I still have a few decades, I hope. Yeah. And You shouldn’t trash this place. Yeah, hotel, you don’t trash the place. You still put everything in order. Don’t destroy furniture. So, you still have to respect the place you are temporarily. Therefore, you become more environmentally aware. Yes. Yeah, that’s another change I realized that I just have to keep the place as tidy. I’ll trash to some degree, because if we consume, every consumer causes production and every production consumes resources. Yes. But we have to just be aware that we don’t overdo it. I have a simple life.

Simple life is a good life. I agree. I’ve never been personally never been a materialistic person. Material things have never had great significance to me. I’m perfectly happy with a second-hand couch. Or going and buying clothing from the op shop. I’d rather recycle and renew the resources that we currently have. That’s how I’ve always been. Because a part of me always knew that, you know, this reality really doesn’t mean a lot in the grand scheme of things. It’s, a tool to teach us lessons. To help us find ourselves and our place. But material things you can’t take with you. You take the learning and the love, so everything’s temporary.

Everything’s temporary.

Absolutely. Simon, this has been an interesting conversation. And I’m so glad that we had this chance to talk. Before we wind up, would you like to share with my listeners where people can contact you? Or how they can learn more about you?

Yeah, I have a website metacomputics.com so on my website, I have a link to my YouTube channel. To my terminal called X and my publications and my q and a section. And also do a private consultation for people who really interested how to get out of the matrix. oh awesome. Yeah. I talk to people individually to help them to locate themselves, as I mentioned. And then from there we together, we work out personalized roadmap. And also, I support people along the way to help them to overcome obstacles on the way out. And so eventually people would benefit from working together with me. To feel free. To feel happier. To feel abundant. And so have a healthy life.

That’s awesome. And for my listeners, if you didn’t get that information that Simon just gave us. It will be on this episode’s page on the podcast website, www.walkingtheshadowlands.com. And I’ll have links to Simon’s website from that page, so you can contact him through there. Simon, thank you so much for your time this episode, it’s been a really interesting and enlightening conversation. And I really appreciate your time today.

Thank you, Marianne again for having me.

And there you have it, everyone! What an incredible journey with Dr Simon Duan into the world of metacomputics. A huge thanks to Simon for sharing his insights and taking us on a wild ride through the realms of possibility. To all our wonderful listeners, thank you for joining us on this mind-bending adventure. Don’t forget to share your thoughts and theories with us on social media – I love hearing from you! Also, feel free to leave a rating and comment about this episode on your preferred podcasting app.

Stay curious. Stay awesome. And this is Marianne bidding you farewell from the shadowlands.

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