{"id":1914,"date":"2021-10-03T02:06:09","date_gmt":"2021-10-03T02:06:09","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.walkingtheshadowlands.com\/?p=1914"},"modified":"2024-11-16T21:30:18","modified_gmt":"2024-11-16T08:30:18","slug":"episode-70-born-haunted","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.walkingtheshadowlands.com\/?p=1914","title":{"rendered":"Episode 70: Born Haunted"},"content":{"rendered":"
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Episode 70: Born Haunted<\/strong><\/p><\/h3><\/div>

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Hi Everyone. Welcome to the very last episode of season five of our podcast. I\u2019ll be taking a four week break to rest a wee bit and to prepare episodes and line up guests for season six. So actually, it\u2019s not really that much of a break for me, truth be told I\u2019m not going to replay any old episodes as you can access all five seasons from your favourite free podcasting app anyway. Or, you can listen to them all from our podcast website www.walkingtheshadowlands.com<\/p>\n

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Nate Michael<\/p><\/div>\n

But today, for now, I\u2019d like you all to imagine that you are a wee kid, resting in your bed at night when all of a sudden you start hearing noises coming from your bedroom closet. Sounds like any number of horror movie beginnings, or that Disney movie \u2013 Monsters Inc. But this is no movie, and these are not blue, cute, lovable furry monsters. This is real life! Noises turn into voices telling you to \u2018let me out!\u2019 or \u2018come and join me!\u2019 You lay there terrified and traumatised until you start to see a shadowy \u2013 snake-like form slithering out from under your closet door, that has opened by itself as you watched. Terrified you run crying from your room, your supposed safe haven, and sleep on the couch in the lounge, or on the lounge floor. Every night this happens to you. How would you deal with this as a child? What would you do? Would you do anything differently?<\/p>\n

This was my guest\u2019s dilemma – but the question as always is \u2013 Are you willing to walking with me into this part of the Shadowlands and see what awaits us there? Good! Then let\u2019s begin.<\/p>\n

My guest is the debut author of a book called \u2018Born Haunted: My Lifelong Encounters with the Paranormal\u2019 His book has received award nomination from the following places: Best Indie Book Award, Dragonfly Book Awards, and Writer\u2019s Digest Awards. Nate was born and raised in Fort Wayne, Indiana; where he met his wife and still lives today. He has a professional license in Medication Administration and currently works in the medical field. He\u2019s an expert on paranormal phenomena, occult studies, and Wicca\/Witchcraft.<\/p>\n

His life-long experiences with the strange and supernatural have brought him great knowledge which he seeks to share with all of his readers. When he isn\u2019t writing or studying the paranormal and occult, he enjoys playing the guitar, gardening and spending time outdoors with his young daughter and wife. My guest Nate Michael.<\/p>\n

Born Haunted<\/strong><\/h3>\n

Marianne: Thank you so much for agreeing to speak with us today Nate. I read your book and it was absolutely fascinating. I really felt for you as a little child with all the experiences you went through. Not, not a very pleasant time. Maybe you could start at the beginning and talk us through your journey?<\/p>\n

Nate:<\/strong> Honestly, my experiences began before I could even remember. My mother explained that when I was an infant she would have a lot of experiences herself.\u00a0 Holding me, rocking me to sleep at night, those kinds of things. She would have premonitions, if you will. Or dreams that would later come to be true and they were usually kind of devastating. They would involve accidents, or murders in the local area, in our area, that did come to fruition. So, I guess that\u2019s where my beginnings in having these experiences \u2013 experiences in the paranormal first started. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/em>From what I can remember I had a lot of encounters, I would call them entities, ghosts, spirits. Beginning at around four or five years of age. That\u2019s about the time that I can remember. It happened before that, but I just couldn\u2019t, I can\u2019t remember it. So I – \u00a0speaking on what I can remember I was about four or five years when those experiences began.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. So what do you? What do you first remember?<\/p>\n

It would be an entity that lived in my closet. I referred to it as an evil spirit, because, that\u2019s what it told me it was. After many nights of being terrorised by it, I finally had asked it. What are you? You know? Go away! What are you doing here? What are you? Something to that extent and it said; \u201cI\u2019m an evil spirit.\u201d<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. So when you say you were terrorised, what sort of things would happen? Like, you say this entity came from your closet? So would it like open your closet door and come into your room? Did you just feel a presence? Or, how did it manifest itself?<\/p>\n

Well it had a lot of \u2013 there was a lot of noise that would come from the closet. A lot of calling my name. Asking me to come in. Asking me to let it out.\u00a0 Those kinds of things. I would frequently sleep on the couch, or the living room floor, \u2018cause, I did not want to sleep in my room. And, it got so bad that my Mother and Father took me to my paediatrician at the time, and said he won\u2019t sleep in his room. He\u2019s having a hard time sleeping at night. What can we do? And the paediatrician had recommended that they lock me in my room at night. Shut the door and just kind of tough it out. That I have to understand it\u2019s my room.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So eventually I would leave my room crying and sleep on the couch, or the floor \u2013 whatever. But it would call out my name. Ask me to open the door. And then, it would eventually turn into a snake like shadow that would kind of creep out from underneath the crack in the closet door. And that\u2019s usually the point when I would run out of my room and I was done with it for the night. You know? I would sleep on the couch.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Oh that\u2019s absolutely terrifying for a \u2013 well for anybody, but especially for a little kid. And of course, as parents we don\u2019t always appreciate what our children are experiencing. Very often we think it\u2019s just \u2013 you know, imagination or night terrors. And so we don\u2019t always understand what they\u2019re going through. So, for you obviously, this was a very, very traumatic time.<\/p>\n

Yes, absolutely. And, and I have a young daughter myself so\u2026. And, I try to be as scientific about things before I jump to any other conclusion, so you know it kind of makes you wonder. And it is scary, are they \u2013 are these things real? And is that really something that they\u2019re seeing. And having had these experiences myself, I know to be much more open minded, and to not dismiss what children say. They, they may be able to see things that we can\u2019t, or hear things \u2013 or whatever.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Absolutely! So what finally transpired that this entity ah, declared what he was to you? What brought that about?<\/p>\n

So again, I had asked it what are you? Or to leave. What are you doing here? What are you? Something along those lines, and it actually said it was an evil spirit. And I told my parents that. And I, I don\u2019t want to say that they didn\u2019t believe me, but obviously they were trying to – you know, keep calm [inaudible], in spite of everything. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So I guess the real tipping point, when they started to really believe my claims, was one evening when my mother had gotten up out of bed. It was late., very late at night and there was a window pane about \u2013 oh on our front door, and it was fogged over. She thought that was a little weird. It wasn\u2019t normally fogged over at that time. So she walked over to it and she noticed in the fog, the condensation in that window pane, that there was a, a expletive word. B word. B i t c h, written in the window pane fog. But, certainly it wasn\u2019t me. I was young. I was asleep on the couch. My dad was asleep. She was the only one up. The doors were locked so there was no explanation. I think that was when they really knew something was, something negative was there in that home with us.\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Well, certainly something that called your mum by, you know, foul language, definitely is not a positive being. And, I remember reading in your book you were only a few feet away from that window.<\/p>\n

Yes, I was. And that was one thing that really terrified my mum about that, is that I was right there, you know? I mean, just feet away on the couch. Sleeping on the couch, \u2018cause, I couldn\u2019t sleep in my room. Because, of what I was saying, the evil spirit that was in my closet. So, it was very terrifying for her and I think it really disturbed her.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So what happened after that? After that incident?<\/p>\n

We had a lot of doors being opened. Lights being turned on when no one was at home \u2013 after we turned them off and left. When we came back home, they would be on. Police were called to make sure there was no intruder, but there was no intruder. <\/em>My, before my sister was born \u2013 shortly after my sister was born, was when we decided to move out of that house. My mum was having a lot of terrifying dreams, a lot of nightmares. And that activity continued with lights and doors being on, unlocked and me continuing on about the evil spirit in my closet. So, we decided to move after my sister was \u2013 shortly after my sister was born.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. I do remember reading in your book that you said, how you guys had been out one night and you came home and all your windows were \u2013 oh, the lights were on. And the front door and the back door were open. Is that right?<\/p>\n

Yes. Yes, we\u2019d been out doing some shopping and running some errands. And, when we came home every door in the home was open! Every light was on!\u00a0 And they are all locked before we left. We were always good about keeping, keeping the doors locked, and those things, so\u2026.\u00a0 It was very strange. Called the police right away. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

They came out there, with their pistols drawn. They did a sweep of the home and could not find anything. Nothing was out of place. All the lights on, all the doors open. They were just \u2013 it was just alarming to have that to \u2013 to know that your home is open to anyone to walk into. And then, who did that? Or, what did that?<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah. Really scary and it would have made you all feel quite vulnerable, especially your mum. Because, she would have been extra worried about you and your safety, and being pregnant. Was she pregnant at that stage? Or was that before she was pregnant?<\/p>\n

I think that might have been right before she was pregnant. I think she \u2013 yeah might have been right before.<\/span> \u00a0<\/em><\/p>\n

But even so, you know, as a mum I \u2013 just myself, I would have been absolutely terrified for you. But, how do you protect your child from something that you can\u2019t see, but you know is there?<\/p>\n

Exactly! Exactly. And again it was a time of nineteen \u2013 oh I think it was the nineteen-eighties, so\u2026. I don\u2019t think those kind of things were well receipted back then, so \u2013 or talked about as much as they are today. So, it was one of those things, you know, you kind of kept secret and you didn\u2019t tell too many outsiders about. People outside of the family.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. So after your sister was born you guys moved to a new home?<\/p>\n

Yes, yep, yes. We moved to a new home and, of course, there was activity there as well! Not right away<\/em>. <\/span>It didn\u2019t start right away, it – I would say within the first month it started. And it was always things you could dismiss, or you know, blame on the wind. Footsteps or something like that. But, things got a little stranger and we couldn\u2019t dismiss them any more.\u00a0 So then we knew that the new home we moved into was indeed occupied by another being, spirit, or haunted if you will.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. And you don\u2019t feel that it was the entity from the other house followed you?<\/p>\n

We don\u2019t. \u00a0We don\u2019t believe that it was. I had actually spoken to \u2013 when we moved into the home, the new home, I began speaking with some \u2018imaginary friends\u2019. And, from my conversations with them, and I believe \u2013 I still to this day believe they were very real. One was a native American. One was a former farmer of the land, or what I thought to be of the land. So, I don\u2019t believe it was the same being or entity. I personally don\u2019t.<\/span>\u00a0 <\/em>And there was no \u2013 there wasn\u2019t anything saying that it was an evil spirit. Like there was in the previous home, so I think it may be associated with the land there or something. But, definitely activity continued there as well, so\u2026<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So these spirit that were your \u2018imaginary friends\u2019 did they give you information about their lives?<\/p>\n

One was. His name was chooless, so\u2026. And he was, what I perceived to be a native American. And he had told me some things about a river, and there was a river nearby our home that I wasn\u2019t too well aware of after first moving in, obviously. And he had made some comments about the river and some rituals. And, some things they had done. But, I may have been a little too young to understand that, so looking back, I fully understand what that was now. But, the other one was a former \u2013 I believe a former land owner, or farmer of the area. But there was some of the things the \u2018imaginary friends\u2019 quote, unquote, had spoke to me and what they said.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. And obviously you were comfortable with these spirit?<\/p>\n

Yes. Very much so, I mean they were friends. I didn\u2019t, I didn\u2019t see them as negative. I didn\u2019t feel anything negative when I was around them. We would play and I can remember playing in the spare room where our toys were kept and things like that. I can remember playing in there with them and asking Chooless and Bobby to play and I don\u2019t remember anything bad. It was never bad. It just was just a friend. It was just friends.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right, and you would have noticed the difference from your previous experience. You would have known enough then to trust your feelings?<\/p>\n

Yeah, yes. I think I would have noticed and I didn\u2019t get that right away. No.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. And so, how long were you in this house? And did you keep up communication with these spirits for like, you know? Was it years?<\/p>\n

It was several years, yeah. It was \u2013 if my memory serves me right, I believe we were in there for approximately oh seven years or so. And I did for a time, but, I grew older and so I kind of stopped doing that, and got interested in some other things. But, my younger sister was growing up. Obviously, from her end. Now she was a toddler and growing older. So she began to play with the same \u2018imaginary friends\u2019 quote, unquote. And with the same names and everything!<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So, could it be something that she picked up from her older brother, me? Or was she seeing them as well? I believe she may have been seeing them, but\u2026. So, that did continue with my sister. But, we did have other things. We had \u2013 One thing that did occur a lot, that was kind of strange, was the toilet paper would be unrolled, nearly nightly. And folded into nice little piles at the end of the toilet. So it was just kind of weird. <\/em><\/span>We heard a loud bang! It was a door closing late at night. My father thought it was an intruder, but there was no one there. The door was locked. Several experiences in that home.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Yes. Well that toilet paper one must have been very interesting!<\/p>\n

It, it\u2019s different. I\u2019m not sure what to make of it. I don\u2019t know what the message was there? Or there was a message? Or was it residual? I\u2019m not really sure what to make of it. But looking back on it, it was interesting for sure. And kind of funny. Kind of funny<\/em>.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

I would say it would be an active, an active spirit, rather than residual. Because, residual is only like a tape recorder playing over and over again. But, this one had intelligence enough to fold the toilet paper. Maybe, that\u2019s the way they used to have it?<\/p>\n

Who knows? I don\u2019t know. It\u2019s interesting, very interesting and I do think it\u2019s kind of funny.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

It is kind of funny. How did your mum and dad deal with it?<\/p>\n

At first again, they tried to brush things off, you know? It was probably the kids. Or, did you guys do this? And we\u2019d say oh no, it was our imaginary friends, and they had some experiences, especially with the door closing as I mentioned. Late at night. Dad got his pistol, his gun out. He went downstairs and he just couldn\u2019t figure it out, the door was completely locked. And, this was one point where they completely knew that, oh boy, there\u2019s activity in this home as well.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

So one of those kind of things. You would hear some voices. Occasionally your name being called, so\u2026. I think, I think they began to realise it as well then. The toilet paper was kind of odd and funny, but they had some of their own experiences. Some of the things they haven\u2019t shared with me, so\u2026<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. I remember in your book that your father had gotten his gun, because he thought that somebody had broken the front door down<\/p>\n

Yes. It was very loud. The whole \u2013 it was like the walls were shaking. I mean, it was just as if someone had slammed the door as hard as they possibly could. Or kicked it down. Or something of that nature. It wasn\u2019t just a gentle closing of the door. It was extremely forceful, to awaken the whole family and automatically assume the door was being kicked down, or blown down by, by some kind of force.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Yeah. <\/em>Yeah, well that\u2019s what you\u2019d assume wouldn\u2019t you? Hearing a noise like that. And, to go down and discover nothing. That must have been very perturbing for your dad. Again, \u2018cause, how do you protect your family against something that you can\u2019t see?<\/p>\n

Exactly, exactly.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So, did you ever talk to your parents about your experiences as you got older? Did you ever discuss what you guys had experienced together?<\/p>\n

Yeah, oh yeah. We still talk about it today. I\u2019m very open about it. I know like my father he\u2019s, he doesn\u2019t want to go too deep into things. But, he does not deny it, he \u2013 It\u2019s something that we talk about. Something that we lived through. So it\u2019s a big part of our life, and I don\u2019t think that we should dismiss it. I think we should talk about it. It\u2019s something that happened when we were growing up, you know, it shaped certain aspects of our family and our being.\u00a0\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Oh absolutely. I agree with that. But you know, I understand that your parents came from a more traditionally, religious background, so it must have been hard for them to deal with this?<\/p>\n

Yes. We actually had called in a clergyman from a local church. We\u2019d been refused by several churches, because, they said they didn\u2019t believe in that. And my family was traditional. Traditional, modern, Christian. So they would also look that way for answers. And it was very confusing to them. It was very confusing to them.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah, I can imagine it would be, and scary. Like yeah, \u2018cause, it didn\u2019t fall in their paradigms of belief. So, they had to like, think outside of the box and accept something that wasn\u2019t a part of their reality. That\u2019s really scary and deal with their children at the same time.<\/p>\n

Exactly<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So for all of you, it would have been a very confusing, and a very scary time. Your poor mum –\u00a0 I really feel for her, because, you know she had to like, hold it together for you guys. Not show her fears, so she didn\u2019t pass on her fear to you. And, be in that home, you know? Scary, scary stuff. So there, there you are. You\u2019ve moved past your first experience, onto your second house and you\u2019ve got these imaginary friends, which we know, aren\u2019t imaginary friends. And then what happens from there?<\/p>\n

So activity continued. I had one, one experience that really frightened me. A couple of experiences that were very, very frightening to me at the time when I was younger. So I think too, at a younger age you look at things different, so maybe if it happened today it wouldn\u2019t be as frightening. You know, maybe I would approach it differently? I would ask what was going on, instead of being scared and hiding. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So more activity continued. We had a pastor come out from a local church. Again, many refused and said that the paranormal didn\u2019t exist. So we found one \u2013 A pastor that, that was stepping \u2013 he said, stepping outside his church. Because, him and his wife had, had experiences personally. So he came. He did some prayer over the house. Blessing of the house. He gave us some tips and tricks, if you will, that he had learned.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So the activity kind of \u2013 it didn\u2019t stop, but it lessened. And then, it wasn\u2019t too long after that, that we decided to move. So looking back, I don\u2019t know if my parents had called the pastor out, knowing that we were going to be moving? And didn\u2019t want to pass this onto the next person? Or, feel guilty not disclosing it? So, so we did move after the pastor came out and things lessened.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

From, from there, how long were you guys in that house?<\/p>\n

We were in that house probably, approximately \u2013 oh boy, I would say a total of oh ten, a little over ten years. From there, then I grew up and then I entered high school, and we had moved. Not too far away from the second home, but, there were no experiences in the third home. Nothing. Nothing to note.<\/span>\u00a0 <\/em>Again, entered high school. Met my current wife. So then moved out, out of my parent\u2019s home. Got my own apartment and became serious with my girlfriend, who\u2019s now my wife, so that\u2019s kind of where I left off after those experiences in the second home. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. And what \u2013 so as you grew older and went though high school and then your, your studies, what are of work did you chose to go into?<\/p>\n

So, I chose to go into healthcare. I always have a deep desire to be in healthcare. I always wanted to do something \u2013 I just knew I needed to be in healthcare. I was a little rebellious in high school and I began to actually start to look into other schools of religion, and other schools of thought. And I sort of had different viewpoints than my parents on life after death, and religious philosophy, and things that I kept secret. And you know, honestly I buried a lot of those paranormal experiences. And, I didn\u2019t want to share those in my twenties and what not. I didn\u2019t want to. I was afraid of what people would think, so I tried to purposely forget those. But, I did always have that interest in it.\u00a0 And then, I became interested again in the different schools of religion, and thoughts, and always having the inkling to work in healthcare. I knew I wanted to work in healthcare. So after high school pursued some certifications and licenses in healthcare. <\/em>\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Oh good for you. I mean, having been a nurse for close to 40 years myself, I totally get it. It\u2019s, it\u2019s like – it\u2019s a calling really. You feel drawn to it. And then you stay there, because, you love it. Because, you know you\u2019re making a positive difference to people\u2019s lives.<\/p>\n

Yes. You can see, you can see your work unfolding right in front of your eyes.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah. Very satisfying. So, then you met your wife, you got married \u2013 oh no. Before you got married you moved in together didn\u2019t you?<\/p>\n

Yes<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

That\u2019s right.<\/p>\n

We did things, we did things a little differently. We moved in before we got married. We moved into a rental home together. And, to be honest, she was sceptical at first. I didn\u2019t share my \u2013 I didn\u2019t share much of my paranormal experiences with her right off the bat.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. Didn\u2019t want to scare her off eh?<\/p>\n

Right. I didn\u2019t want to scare her off. I loved her. I still do love her. I didn\u2019t want her too\u2026. I wanted to marry her someday. So I didn\u2019t want her to think oh boy! This guys nuts, and run away. So I actually didn\u2019t tell her the paranormal experiences I had, right away. That came about after a family gathering.<\/span> <\/em>My mother brought it up, because, we started to have paranormal experiences together. My, at the time fianc\u00e9 \u2013 the rental home we were living in, we were having some things, some ghostly activity.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Didn\u2019t you like \u2013 correct me if I\u2019m wrong, but I remember reading in your book, which is really well written. That, that you had trouble finding a place and then you found this place that was really cheap to rent?<\/p>\n

Yes. We were looking and looking. We could not find anything within our budget, or if there\u2019s something within our budget, it was not as advertised. It was not the pictures that were online. It was much different. So we were having a very hard time, and it seemed as though \u2013 that the rental home we got, we ended up signing the lease with, was the last option. It looked like the pictures that were advertised. It was within our budget. Touring it, it was nice. It was decent. It was \u2013 it felt comfortable. But, it was again that last option.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

But when you\u2026<\/p>\n

And then, we didn\u2019t want to put off moving in together.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Oh yeah. Of course, I understand that. Yeah absolutely. But, and when you got \u2013 initially walked through your home, you didn\u2019t sense anything about it? Like there was nothing missing?<\/p>\n

I didn\u2019t necessarily see anything. Now, I got a feeling<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

That was my \u2013 I said sense. Sorry, that was my kiwi accent.<\/p>\n

Right away \u2013 ah yes, yes. I got a sense. I got a sense. It was \u2013 I describe it as like a think fog. It just kind of felt foggy and the air felt very thick and choked up. I did get that sense right away. But that was before I had told my \u2013 at the time fianc\u00e9, about my previous paranormal experiences, so I just brushed it off. And again, it was a last option. So I did the move in with her. I wanted to continue that aspect of our, my life. So I just kind of dismissed those feelings and thought oh well, maybe it\u2019s just the dehumidifier in here. Or the air\u2019s too hot or something.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0 <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. And that\u2019s a lesson, a lesson in listening to your feelings, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n

Yes. Absolutely.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So, talk us through how things progressed in the home with you and then with your fianc\u00e9?<\/p>\n

So, it started out fairly innocuous. You\u2019d hear a lot of footsteps. My wife \u2013 at the time my fianc\u00e9, she would misplace \u2013 Well items were being misplaced, I don\u2019t believe it was her. She would be combing her hair and turn around just for a split second, and then, the comb would be gone. Or, she\u2019d be fiddling on her cell phone and then she would sit it down, turn and come back to it, and it would be gone. And it would be in a totally different place than where she left it. So, it started out with those kind of things. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

One thing that stood out in my mind was scratching. We started to hear scratching within the walls. And we had called the landlord out, hoping that maybe he could fix it, or maybe find a reasoning. And, every time he would show up it would stop. Nearly as soon as he would pull in the driveway. And he would look around and say, I can\u2019t hear anything. I can\u2019t see anything. So if you guys weren\u2019t such good tenants, you pay the rent. You have good upkeep on the home, I wouldn\u2019t believe you. But, there\u2019s just nothing I can do. So, that\u2019s where it started.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

That\u2019s an experience I hear quite often, is that often people start by hearing scratching in the walls and they think it\u2019s rats or some other animal in the inside of the walls.<\/p>\n

Yes, and it\u2019s, it sounded similar. Like maybe a racoon or something had gotten in the wall, but it was just odd. And it would also seem to kind of follow you from room to room.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Oh? That\u2019s interesting.<\/p>\n

But, you couldn\u2019t quite pin point it and say oh it\u2019s right here in this spot. It\u2019s just I would hear that scratching throughout the room. We would go into the other room and still hear it. So we thought maybe it\u2019s in here? <\/em>\u00a0<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

That must have been quite frustrating for you both? And not really thinking that it was anything nefarious, or ah, otherworldly?<\/p>\n

Right. Exactly, exactly.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

And how did it? What happened after that? How did it escalate?<\/p>\n

So, I think at that point again, we\u2019d had a family gathering and my fianc\u00e9 had mentioned that she thought that maybe the home we were renting was haunted. And of course, my mother chimed in quite quickly and was like well let me tell you a story\u2026. Let me tell you about how we grew up. And my wife, fianc\u00e9 at the time, didn\u2019t know those things. Again, I didn\u2019t disclose them to her. I didn\u2019t want to scare her off! So, it was, it was a relief as well, because I think having those experiences together, in the rental home we were sharing. It turned her into a believer.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. I was going to say, how did she handle your Mum\u2019s disclosure? That must have been \u2013 you must have been going oh no!<\/p>\n

Oh yes. Oh yes, I was absolutely mortified when she was telling all these stories, and you know, all the experiences we\u2019d had. A lot of things we\u2019ve already discussed in here and in my book, and I\u2019m like oh no, she\u2019s going to run away! But she was just like, oh yeah I believe that, because, we\u2019re having experiences in our home that are similar. Doors closing and similar. Yeah, I totally believe that. I think if you had mentioned or asked me that five years ago, and I wouldn\u2019t believe you, \u2018cause, I would have been a sceptic back then. But having these experiences together, I\u2019m a total believer.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Awesome, so that was quite a relief for you then?<\/p>\n

Yes, yes. And then of course that night I had to apologise. I had to apologise and say I\u2019m sorry I didn\u2019t tell you. I just love you too much. I didn\u2019t want to scare you away!<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Aw that\u2019s so sweet. I bet she took it that way as well?<\/p>\n

Oh yes, yes. She took it great. She\u2019s a great woman, I love her dearly.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

So, so after your mum made this disclosure, did things escalate?<\/p>\n

Yeah, yeah I would say\u2026<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Or did you just become more aware of them?<\/p>\n

I think, I think we became more aware of them. I stopped denying the previous experiences, and I accepted them. So I think we opened our eyes then and accepted what was going on. So in that sense, yes it did escalate. And it even affected a visitor I had one time. He had \u2013 he came over and right away he said; \u201cNate, I think this house is haunted. Has anyone died here?\u201d I don\u2019t know, you know?<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So, we went down to the basement, and we were hanging out in the basement. I was showing him around. And then we heard the back door being unlocked. The door handle being fumbled around and then opened. And then closed. And then locked. Some footsteps and so we figured oh, my fianc\u00e9\u2019s home. Footsteps around the house as if she was getting home, walking around. Footsteps into the kitchen and the sink turns on.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

\u00a0And my friend and co-worker says, I don\u2019t want to be in the basement anymore, let\u2019s go up. Let\u2019s get out of here. So we run upstairs and the sinks still running, but there\u2019s no one there! And she was not home! So, that was one experience that really stood out in my mind. Also, I had that friend and co-worker there to verify that I wasn\u2019t crazy and this was really happening.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

How did he react to that?<\/p>\n

He left.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

When you got up the top and the tap was running?<\/p>\n

He left. He, he turned white as a ghost, and I don\u2019t know what excuse. I can\u2019t quite remember the excuse he made, but it was clearly a made up excuse. I don\u2019t blame him. I understand. He left and that was it! He never came back to the home.\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Wow. Yeah, that would have been pretty freaky for somebody who\u2019s never experienced any \u2013 and even for you, even though you\u2019ve experienced it all, to have something that clear, and to have physical proof. You know? With the tap running, is quite a different thing all together. It\u2019s a different kettle of fish.<\/p>\n

Yes. And it, and it was like wow. How are you going to do that to me? You\u2019re my good friend and you just ran out and left me with the tap running.\u00a0\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

So, what did you do after that? After he left, what did you do? Did you leave the house? Did you stay in the house? Did you \u2013 obviously turned the tap off?<\/p>\n

Yes, we turned the tap off. That was one of the first things I did. No, we stayed. We had a rental agreement so we had to meet so many months, or whatever, there in the home. But we stayed and activity continued. But, I became what I would call obsessed with the home. I wanted to, I wanted to find an answer. I wanted to find a reason for what was going on. I was also beginning to have nightmares, very specific to the home. About maybe some things that could be related to what was going on in the home.<\/span>\u00a0 <\/em>So, the nightmares were increasing. Increasing in intensity and I began to do a lot of research on the home. And the land, and the surrounding land. Again, I would say I almost became obsessed with the home and the area.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

And what did you find in your research?<\/p>\n

So in my research, I discovered that the land that the home sat on back in the seventeen-hundreds, was part of a fort. \u00a0And, when I looked at maps with my \u2013 current maps, with my home and compared them to historical maps of the fort they aligned perfectly with the words; \u2018Indian Hanging Grounds\u2019! <\/em><\/span>And I feel that, that may have attributed to maybe some of the energy in the home, and certainly some of those dreams. Because, I was having dreams about tortured Native Americans. Native American Indians.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Oh wow, certainly sounds, from, from…<\/p>\n

The energies \u2013 Anything that harmful done to another human being, it\u2019s got to \u2013 it has to leave some sort of energy behind.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Oh yes. Absolutely has to. Oh that\u2019s dreadful, those poor people. Did you ever try talking to the spirit? Or spirits, do you think there was more than one in your home?<\/p>\n

I do feel that it was more than one. I feel there may have been multiple, because in my research I uncovered that there was a murder took place, in the home! So, I do believe there were multiple entities \u2013 or maybe even something beyond what was formally a person. Maybe something, think elemental, or<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Interdimensional?<\/p>\n

You know, just born out of pure negativity, or something. So I do believe that.\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

That actually brought a thought to my mind, when you talked about the Indian hanging ground. And I wonder, if it was placed there, because, of the energies that were in that specific spot? Like if they were drawn to use that area, because \u2013 or they were influenced by whether it was an elemental, or an Interdimensional being? Because, that\u2019s the energy they feed off of?<\/p>\n

Yes, exactly. I wonder the exact same thing. It\u2019s interesting. It\u2019s fascinating, but it\u2019s scary at the same time.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Very scary. Very scary. So did you, did you ever feel unsafe, like were these experiences negative? Or did they just want your attention?<\/p>\n

No. I feel that it was negative. I, we had one experience, an experience that ultimately led us to leaving the home. Breaking the lease and getting out of there. And that was, one evening my fianc\u00e9 was at work and I was at home watching a sports game, and I had a strong desire to go to the basement to get a bottle of beer. Which would not have been kept in the basement. But, I just knew it was down there and I had to go down there and get it.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

And when I got to the bottom of the stairs, I tripped over and I completely blacked out! I don\u2019t recall falling down, or what happened. I, I blacked out. In the mean time, my fianc\u00e9 finished her shift at work and she had come home. Right away, she knew something was wrong in the house. Something was off. It was dark, where as normally I would have this light or that light on. And it wasn\u2019t on, and she could just sense something.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

She walked in the home and noticed the light coming from the basement. And, she walked down to the basement and saw me sitting there, with just a single candle. And she said, she knew right away it wasn\u2019t me. She could tell by my facial expression and my colour, it just was not me. And she asked something to the extent of, are you ok? What are you doing down here? You\u2019re scaring me.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

And she said my face began to contort and kind of grimace. And she then asked, who the hell are you? \u2018Cause, she knew it wasn\u2019t, it wasn\u2019t me. And out of my mouth, came a voice which wasn\u2019t mine. It was in a difference accent. It was in a different tone. It told her not to worry about me, that I would be ok. That it\u2019s name was \u2018evil\u2019, and it was destruction.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

And that ultimately led us to leaving the home. After that occurred, I \u2018woke\u2019 up several hours later. I had a massive headache, I felt nauseous. And my fianc\u00e9 was sitting over me, and I, I was just \u2013 you know? Confused. I said, oh I must have had a bad dream? And she said no honey, I think you were possessed.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Wow, wow. That would have been very scary for her. Did you, prior to that, did you find your thoughts changing? Were you having negative thoughts of harming, or self harming, or anything like that?<\/p>\n

No. I would say that my demeanour changed slightly. A little more aggressive. I wouldn\u2019t say necessarily say thoughts of harming. But again, I was becoming obsessed with research, and it that there was a lot of harm and a lot of negativity. And having those dreams, coupled with the experience of this being speaking through my mouth, I just knew \u2013 I knew it was time to get out of there. I think I was more afraid that I may begin to experience those, those thoughts.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right, right. \u2018Cause, to me it kind of feels like a web. Drawing you in. Drawing you in.\u00a0<\/em><\/p>\n

Yes, exactly.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

So you were probably very smart to get out when you did, and when you \u2013 I guess your landlord wasn\u2019t particularly surprised when you left?<\/p>\n

No, he wasn\u2019t too surprised. Many folks had been through that rental home and they did not stay long. Many folks broke the lease. Left without notice. So he wasn\u2019t particularly surprised. But, on the same hand I didn\u2019t quite bring up I think there was something going on with this home, because, I don\u2019t know that he would have fully acknowledged it. That he was even fully aware of it.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Right. Because, it makes him liable, I guess?<\/p>\n

Exactly, exactly. <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

And, and so, after you moved out how did you resolve all of these experiences in your life? Have you had any since?<\/p>\n

Not any experiences in my home. Personally I believe that these types of entities, beings, spirits \u2013 whatever you wish to call them, are around all the time. I think they\u2019re everywhere.\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

They are.<\/p>\n

And sometimes you may come into contact with them in certain places. So no, I don\u2019t have any experiences in my home currently. But, where my wife works \u2013 she works at a bar, and I\u2019ve had some experiences there. Actually, recently I had some experiences with knocking and thought somebody was in the kitchen in the bar, so\u2026. And there was no one there! <\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

But no, nothing in my home. Everything has since calmed down. But those, having those experiences definitely lead to a greater interest. Wanting to do more research and to understand the paranormal and these things, which lead to other research and things, and schools of thought. Ideas on Wicca and stuff like that.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right and so now you\u2019re at a place \u2013 a space in your life where if you had an experience like that again you would know what to do. You would know how to deal with it, and you wouldn\u2019t have the same fear that you had previously. And what I really liked \u2013 I mean your book was really good reading. But what I really liked about it, was your end chapter where you talked about things people can do. And how they can deal with it. And, I think that\u2019s really important. And I know for a lot of people it could make a big difference, because, who knows? Whoever brought your book, may have brought it because of the same sort of things.<\/p>\n

Exactly. Exactly and that\u2019s what I hoped to do. And looking back, I wish I would have had some of these pieces of information. And they\u2019re not anything you know, too revelationary, they\u2019re very simple things you can do. Some ideas to help with those paranormal occurrences. So, I wish I had those. Little pieces of information to help me deal with what I was experiencing.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right. And so, I guess your deciding to write this book was part of your healing and letting go process, yeah.<\/p>\n

You\u2019re absolutely correct. You\u2019re absolutely correct. That is absolutely true. Again it\u2019s something I kept secret. I didn\u2019t tell many, I didn\u2019t tell nearly anyone. So to get that out, I wanted to get it out to the whole world. And you\u2019re right, it has. I feel it has healed myself and made me better. And helped put me on the path I need to be.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Right, and now you can put that in perspective of, I was a child. I didn\u2019t know any better. I didn\u2019t know how to deal with my emotions. Now, I\u2019m an adult I can look back and you know?<\/p>\n

Exactly.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Do you feel that, that spirit that said they were an evil spirit was actually a spirit? Or do you think that they were just a nasty, nasty human spirit who wanted to scare you, because, you were a little kid, and he could?<\/p>\n

You know, looking back, honestly I think it may have been someone who just really wanted to scare me. Just because they could. I don\u2019t know that it was truly evil. Because, all it really said \u2013 it only said it was evil. And then it wrote foul language and things like that. But other than that, all it could get to me at, was through fear. Someone just masquerading as something truly evil. Just wanting to truly scare a little child. Yes, I agree with that.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Yes. When I read that, the first thought that came to my mind was, oh that\u2019s not an evil spirit. This is just a nasty, nasty human spirit, who was a nasty, mean person in life. And liked terrifying and tormenting those around him, and he\u2019s just continued in this \u2013 in the next spirit \u2013 he hasn\u2019t moved over. He\u2019s just earthbound and he\u2019s just nasty. He\u2019s hurting. It\u2019s been my experience that spirit like that, are like that, because, they are generally hurting. They\u2019re in pain of some description.<\/p>\n

Yes, I think so. Yeah.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

And, and I guess looking back, having the perspective and knowledge that you have now \u2013 while it doesn\u2019t ease the fears that you had at that time, you understand it a little bit more, with an adult\u2019s perspective.<\/p>\n

Yes. You can go into it saying, is it truly an evil spirit? Or is it someone who\u2019s had some extreme hardships in life? And is just trying to be a nasty individual?<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Yes, right.<\/p>\n

Exactly right.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Very cool. So where do you go from here?<\/p>\n

Oh from there, the wife and I got married. We had a kid. I worked in healthcare over ten years. Again not any paranormal experiences in the home. So out in the public somewhat I run into these things. I think we all do. And then began to get interested in Wicca and Pagan traditions and other schools of thoughts and types of religious ideology<\/span>.\u00a0 <\/em><\/p>\n

Right and that would also have given you more tools to help deal with spiritual parasites, and, and earthbound spirits. And stuff that haven\u2019t moved on. So have you had any experiences at work? With clients?<\/p>\n

I have. I have had experiences at work. Nothing negative. Everything very positive.\u00a0 A lot of \u2013 ah, I worked in Geriatrics, in a nursing home for quite some time. So I had the opportunity of being by patient\u2019s bedside as they were experiencing the death process. And I had a lot of experiences through that. Folks always seem to claim \u2013 witnessing a bright, white light at the end of a tunnel. I\u2019ve had folks talking about family members that were in the room. And there\u2019s just things that you can just sense, and kind of pick up on. You can feel someone else in the room.<\/span>\u00a0 <\/em>And we\u2019ve had some other, what I call playful, ghostly type activity, from what we believe to be former residents of the nursing facility. See I think there\u2019s a lot of activity in the medical field. I think it\u2019s something that goes on frequently.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah. I know, I certainly had my share in my years of nursing. And I know that geriatric nursing is very, very difficult. Like physically it\u2019s hard, but, also emotionally. Because, you get attached to those that you\u2019re working with, and, and you care about them. For the most part. Most nurses<\/p>\n

Yes, they become part of the family, yeah.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah. Yeah and a lot of them don\u2019t have any family, so you become their family for them.<\/p>\n

Exactly, exactly. You\u2019re exactly right.\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

Yeah, yeah. So where do you think you\u2019re going to go from here. So, you\u2019ve written the book, it\u2019s out there. What are your plans for the future?<\/p>\n

Plans for the future? I want to continue my studies in Wicca and become the best person that I can, and pass that onto my daughter. I\u2019d like to maybe write another book. But, it\u2019s not something I\u2019m jumping into right away. I have some ideas I\u2019m tossing around that kind of tie into paranormal, but not so much directly related to the paranormal. But, we\u2019ll see where the future goes. Who knows where the future\u2019s going to take us, and I\u2019m just going to ride that out and try to make the best of it and be as positive as I can.\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

That\u2019s really cool. So Nate, thank you so much for your time today. It\u2019s been a really interesting discussion. Thank you for your book, it\u2019s really beautifully written and would you \u2013 would you like to tell people about your website and where they can \u2013\u00a0 and your social media that you\u2019re on?<\/p>\n

Yeah. So first of all, thank you for having me on. It\u2019s, it\u2019s been an honour. It\u2019s been a pleasure. I appreciate it, thank you. And to all the listeners out there. You can get the book on Amazon. It\u2019s available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. And on my website. I do international shipping from my website, which is <\/em>www.bornhaunted.com<\/em><\/a> then Facebook. The Facebook page is Born Haunted by Nate Michael. And then my author page is Nate Michael. Sorry, I had to think which one there so\u2026. Facebook page is Born Haunted by Nate Michael and then my author is Nate Michael.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Are you on Instagram and twitter or anything like that? Or just the Facebook.<\/p>\n

I\u2019m not at the moment, but that\u2019s in the works.<\/em><\/span><\/p>\n

Awesome, so you have a really great night Nate. Thank you very much for your time.<\/p>\n

Alright, thank you I appreciate it. Have a good day.<\/span> <\/em><\/p>\n

\u00a0<\/em><\/p>\n<\/div>

<\/div><\/div>

I can\u2019t begin to imagine how terrifying it must have been for Nate as a child growing up, terrorised by unknown entities. How would you even begin to process that as a child? Even as an adult? I\u2019d like to thank Nate for sharing his experiences with us all in this episode<\/p>\n

If you enjoyed this episode, and indeed if you enjoy the Walking the Shadowlands podcast and you would like to help support the running costs of the show, then please consider becoming a patron of the show, then head over to to patreon.com\/Mcc15<\/a> and sign up now. As a patron you get access to a special members only page on the podcast website www.walkingtheshadowlands.com from which you can download full transcripts of each episode, you also have access to some interview bits that may not make the episodes and little extras as I have time to create and add them for you. Also you have my absolute gratitude and appreciation. So what are you waiting for? Go to patreon.com\/Mcc15<\/a> and sign up now.<\/p>\n

Today\u2019s creepy bumper music is called Insidiously Wicked from Cinema.<\/p>\n

If you have any suggestions for topics you might like me to cover in upcoming episodes, then please don\u2019t hesitate to contact me. Or, if any of you have any questions, suggestions, or any comments that you\u2019d like to make, or experiences that you might like to share with myself, or my audience \u2013 or, if you feel you might be a good fit as a guest on my podcast, then just email me at shadowlands@myyahoo.com<\/a>. Or, check out the \u2018be a guest\u2019 page on the podcast website.<\/p>\n

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If you don\u2019t have a smartphone, then you can listen to the episodes from the podcast website www.walkingtheshadowlands.com For those hearing-impaired, there is a full written transcript of each episode on the website. So you don\u2019t miss out at all. Tell your friends! Tell your family! Tell your workmates about our show! Encourage them to listen, and to subscribe also \u2013 the more the merrier.<\/p>\n<\/div>

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